Cave Creek weighs $205,000 Bartlett Dam feasibility study commitment ahead September vote

welcome to the special council meeting if you'll take your seats the meeting is now called to order this meeting today has a has a single has a single item uh the uh Bartlett Cal Bartlett Dam uh participation and um I'd like to recognize our representative Cen in the audience today thank you for coming by thank you um and with that I wonder if you would lead us in the Pledge of Allegiance I pledge Al to the flag of the United States of America and to the for stands Nation God indivisible with liy and justice for all looks like we have an a lively audience tonight we have some special guests and um the agenda item is a council discussion of the proposed expansion of Bartlet Lake and possible direction to staff regarding possibility of Cave Creek joining the Consortium of other municipalities and water providers for this infrastructure project and we have Salt River staff here today and our own utility director uh who I'll turn the meeting over to at this time thank you mayor and Council so yes we're excited to be able to uh have this presentation by SRP staff of this project the project actually started a few years ago um but the town's looking to see if we can um evaluate whether or not we want to join on to the the group that's already been moving forward it still has a few more years through to get through the design phase and environmental assessment phase so uh it's not into construction yet but it's in the in the formation phase of that project so the town does have a small window to get in on this project um and for everybody it's it's um an expansion of a the Bartlet on Salt River projects uh lands which actually on the verie river which will increase capacity and it's the additional capacity that's being distributed so that it's something that um won't allow us to get new water for new development but it actually helps Shore up the town's water supplies and it's almost a year ago today uh that we actually spoke to the town last about our master plan and all the exercises that we're going through and then potential hardships the town will have with things like the reallocation of the Colorado River water um and in a few weeks we'll be bringing back the completed master plan uh but tonight uh we had this special meeting to have SRP present to council and then staff will follow that up with a recommendation from Council of what we think is the best solution for the town to move forward with uh so at the table tonight we have Olivia Galvin and Kyle tigman uh Jacob Rodriguez will be coming up and they'll be talking about the um the facility itself what's going on and Anthony Beckham will actually follow up after a 10-minute video that we actually have that will explain it's called the skiff it's the Salt River cap interchange facility um and there's also a k or there's another one what's the other one CFS um but I think the video actually helped explain it and actually when I saw it it it really pulled it all together so with that um and we also have Patricia D Roa is the um cap um or sorry the SRP intergovermental Affairs person in the room we also have some people from we have Michelle vanan and um uh uh Brandy I keep emailing on Brandy every day here is Brandy Thigpen from black and Beach here representing the town uh both our town legal water attorney and and the the master plan staff so with that I'll turn it over to SRP staff to% yeah good afternoon I guess good evening mayor and Council thanks for having SRP out for this special council meeting do I control this from here Sean okay by introductions my name is Kyle Tilman I'm the director of water strategy at Salt River Project of which this project this study falls under my organization I'm going to do just a quick highlight of the the system the river system itself our facilities and kind of turn this over to Olivia and Jacob to get into the nuts and bolts of the study that we're doing with the Bureau of Reclamation as far as the birie system and the sediment that's occurring on the birie system so with this a quick highlight of the the SRP Watershed is a 13,000 square mile Watershed in North Northern Arizona as indicated on this map uh we do have six dams currently that are owned by the Bureau of Reclamation two of those dams are on the verie river that would be horseshoe and Bartlett there's four dams on the Salt River system so the Roosevelt oh my goodness I'm going to be tested here so that's a a Pache Lake uh Mormon flat and then Stewart Mountain so those are the four dams on the Salt River system we do have a seventh Dam which is on the Clear Creek System which is CC kraan up in the northern part of our Watershed all those dams with the associated rivers and streams comprise of our Watershed to which we make deliveries here to the valley in a 244 square mile 244 square mile service territory so this is g to be a little confusing but I'll try to walk through it very slowly here so kind of the toe left you'll see CC kraan at the top middle that's a standalone Dam on the Clear Creek System you'll see that capacity there if you're work your way down and to the left you have horseshoe Dam and then Bartlett Dam those two as I mentioned are the two dams on the verie river they total uh storage capacity wise of 276,000 acre feet um item to note which is why we're pursuing the uh study with the Bureau of Reclamation we are seeing significant sediment uring over time behind horseshoe there in lies some lost storage capacity that we're not able to regain unless we go through this study effort with the Bureau of Reclamation on trying to recapture that lost storage behind horseshoe on the right side of the screen you'll see those four dams on the Salt River system which total about 2 million acre feet of storage I want to point out comparatively the bir system is 12% of srp's total storage capacity so when we start looking at lost capacity on the verie system due to sediment it adds up pretty quickly of how much we are not able to store because of the small nature of the birie system itself the salt system is the backbone of our system but there's opportunities through this study to see how we can regain that capacity on the verie to restore our rights to our shareholders this chart does a couple of things for us as we talk about how SRP operates our system here in the valley with the reservoir system the Shaded Blue Area represents from 1980 to 2023 the deliveries that we make each year to our customers here in the valley so in the 1980 almost 1.5 million acre feet to about today which is a just shy of 800,000 acre feet the green bars represent the total inflow that occurs from into our Reservoir system from the water that falls on the Watershed both on the verie and the salt so you can see the variability that occurs during High inflows during the winter season we have more than enough that enters our our Reservoir system to make deliveries to our customers then we have periods of dry winter seasons where we don't have enough inflows coming into the reservoirs to make deliveries to our customers but on the whole with our proper management of our Reservoir system in those High inflows we try to capture as much as we can and store Those Behind the reservoirs to be able to prepare ourselves for those dry years that we can still make deliveries with surface water now in those years where we have consecutive years of dry years dry runoff and we're not able to fill our reservoirs we we do have an active groundwater management plan here in the valley with our wells that we supplement water to our customers in the event we don't have enough surface water to make our deliveries so there in lies the just the ProActive Management of not completely draining the reservoirs by using another source of water to make deliveries but this also highlights with the climate change that's occurring we are expected to be drier and hotter Summers but also colder and wetter Winters with climate change so we don't know how Mother Nature is going to react every year on The Watershed so it's our diligence to store everything we can behind our reservoirs and be able to make those deliveries with surface water but if we had to we have our groundwater fields to supplement our deliveries so this all kind of it leads into the nature of the study kind of the things we're going to address with the study with the Bureau of Reclamation all in an effort one to recapture lost storage due to sediment and two to maintain our deliveries to our shareholders here in the valley so with that I'll get into the details Olivia will on the study with the Bureau of Reclamation and where we're going from there all right so Olivia Galvan I'm the project manager for the feasibility study uh so I do want to give a little bit of background on what a feasibility study is because this is a very unique process um so we are in this partnership with the Bureau of Reclamation um and so that first started with an appraisal study where you at multiple steps throughout this process have to show that there is a problem at hand with potential Solutions so the first step of that was the appraisal study um that identified the problem needed opportunity you look at existing data um develop Alternatives and have stakeholder engagement from there we did determine that this is a problem that needs to be addressed with viable Solutions um and during that the the main problem that we found as Kyle mentioned is the sedimentation on the verie river so our verie Watershed is flashy um we get extreme inflow extreme flash flood events and that brings sediment into the reservoir um horseshoe is the first Reservoir that it sees and so that's why all of that sediment is primarily in horseshoe and that takes place of where water can be stored um as kle mentioned the verie system is 12% of our of our total storage but the verie Watershed gets 40% of our inflow um so you can imagine how that disparity just just compounds this problem that already exists uh from an underbalanced system that is experiencing more sedimentation um due to the Topography of the birie Watershed um so we've lost about 40% of our original storage capacity since construction um and that reduces our available storage for our um SRP water shareholders and then there's um something called City of Phoenix gate water that also exists in horseshoe which is the off- project water for City of Phoenix um so during the appraisal study uh they did identify that a viable solution is the proposed uh Bartlett Dam modification that would be that raised in order to address this loss of storage capacity that has occurred um so our Alternatives that we analyzed in the appraisal study um so you always have to have it without action so you'll see that through the feasibility study as well um as well as a dredging option um many people when they hear about this project and hear about about the problem being sediment in the reservoir the first thing they say is well just go dredge out that sediment go dig it up uh horseshoe is in a very remote spot um where again uh it would be very difficult to access uh in addition to extreme Environmental and Cultural considerations that exist um so still still alternative um but the two primary alternatives are the Bartlet modifications where it would be a raise of 97 ft or 62 feet um and that was identified in the appraisal study and so that went through the whole Federal process um where they looked at those two Dam options so that's how that Reservoir would be expanded so Bartlett um would be expanded and back up to Horseshoe so you can kind of see that inundation area of what that 62t raise would look like versus that 97 foot raise based off of those two damn Heights uh we'll we'll I'll go through more details on the feasibility study so basically they they did identify in the appraisal study that this should move forward to feasibility which is where we are now so the feasibility study was authorized by Title 9 of the bipartisan infrastructure law so that gave us the funding to uh partner with Reclamation to start this feasibility study uh so we're still in the um you know formulating evaluating and comparing alternative plans phase so number four is kind of where we're at currently um and so we are hoping oping to go through the um environmental process pretty shortly um but there there are many many steps to a feasibility study it's not just an engineering analysis of how do you do a 30% design for a dam or how do you do a 30% design for drudging material out of a reservoir it's the uh engineering technical analysis the hydrological technical analysis an economical analysis the financial analysis um there are many many many steps along the way because ultimately this will go to Congress for approval and in order to meet the requirements of a feasibility study you have to check all of these boxes and so that's the process we are going through right now in partnership with Reclamation and part of that partnership is a cost share so it requires a 50% um non-federal cost share so that encompasses SRP and our non-federal partners um so that's currently 23 non-federal Partners which we call the steering committee which Jacob will talk about in a little bit and that is that is's a requirement it has to be 50% uh Reclamation cannot contribute more than 50% so we do have the same problems in the feasibility study that we had in the appraisal study of the loss capacity due to sedimentation as well as the future sediment accumulations along the reservoir um and to Kyle's Point earlier this decreases our resiliency and our ability to store water that then needs to be delivered during drought times um so our the needs of this project is to restore lost capacity manage feature sediment loadings and increase renewable Water Supplies where two of the options are the modified Bartlett Dam proposal so this is kind of a graphic uh of what it would look like so the existing Dam that we have out there is a multiple Arch butress Dam uh completed in 1939 the new dam um because of the dam height and the D Dam Foundation you can't just build on top of a dam there has to be a new dam in front of the old Dam uh so that kind of looks like oh I'll show it on the next screen of what that will look like um but the partners that we have for the feasibility study so this partnership the the non-federal 50% that I mentioned um a lot of those cities are shown on this screen not all of them the the Shaded area is srps on Project water um so many people on the screen are part of this partnership that we have where we are talking about what's called the new verd space capacity so SRP has existing water in Bartlett um as well as the Horseshoe water which will move over to Bartlet um I mentioned the Phoenix gate water capacity that has existed since the 1940s that will also be moving to Bartlett um so the new ver space is what we are talking about today about what can be allocated um and what is available for partners that are interested in obtaining additional water so how are we going to use a modified Bartlet Dam to pass sediment right so the sediment accumulations will continue throughout the verie system uh throughout time uh horseshoe will fill up with sediment over time as more sediment comes in and that sediment will ultimately make its way into Bartlett and one thing that we've learned throughout this process as we do the Hydra Hydra Hydra hydrology hydrological that's word I'm trying to say technical analysis of this study um is the wet ears are going to get wet and the dry ears are going to be more dry and what that means for sediment passage is that those inflows coming in have so much sediment but they have so much force behind them that can then be routed through the reservoir system um so that would use existing horseshoe to pass that sediment flood coming in um and then as that water is moving through Bartlett better engineering on the dam to promote sediment passage without wasting water so we would be looking at these um what we call those verdie spill those green bars that we see here as really the best opportunities to move sediment throughout the system and continue moving it so that we have a solution in the future so that this doesn't happen again oh I lost my damn picture well the new dam the new dam would be in front um it's kind of looks like a boomerang um yeah so one of the things that we assessed as part of the engineering feasibility is how high can you make that Dam so IID mentioned in the appraisal study it was that 97 ft raise uh what we learned through our engineering analysis because we are doing a 30% design of this new dam as one of our Alternatives um is that it could actually be a little bit higher uh the maximum height is actually 101.8 um and that's as high as it can be without impacting horseshoe Dam above which is an additional water supply so the appraisal study identified that new birdie space as 305,000 acre feet uh we are still going through the feasibility study so that number is not finalized finalized but it's around 328,000 100,000 acre feet and now I'll turn over to jaob so that that's a good overview of the Watershed srp's Watershed and the project itself um I'm going to shift gears here a little bit and talk about um project schedule uh I'll show a high level schedule where we're at now and where we're moving in the future um over the next three to six months and then I'll talk about the steering committee um what would be what are the roles and responsibilities of the steering committee um what would be required if the town of Cave Creek decided to join as a participant and what is the timeline as far as um being able to join um we're under kind of a tight timeline right now as we're moving towards NE the NEPA process but I'll I'll talk about that a little bit more and then I'll touch on out the allocation um the new ver space uh we call it nvs is is the allocation um of water that um we are Distributing amongst the 22 non-federal Partners there is some interest um on the federal side for allocation in the new verie space and so that is those discussions are currently being had as well so this this is a high level overview of the schedule um the upper portion the yellow portion there is the federal study where we are in the Federal study the lower portion in blue is the non-federal activities that are currently taking place or that have taken place um the red line there um kind of moving up and down from the top to the bottom of the screen there is currently where we're at so as Olivia mentioned we've completed the appraisal study we are moving into the feasibility study we're identifying different Alternatives and providing information background information on each of those Alternatives from a technical perspective working with the Bureau of Reclamation on um those Alternatives and um putting together what I would say 30% design um uh pref feasibility um uh uh practices right now to move into the actual feasibil feasibility study um the the goal right now is we're looking to move into the NEPA process um in February uh so so in order to do that we need to issue the noi by the end of November uh the notice of intent um and so that that kind of tells you right now that that kind of shows just the tight timeline that we're under before we issue the noi we do need to understand all the participants and the allocation of the uh new bir space so um that that's kind of what we would be working towards uh the NEPA process and the feasibility study process would um wrap up in the 2027 time frame and at that point we would be moving in we would be looking to get uh Congressional authorization um that would probably um spill over into 2028 hoping to get a decision in 2028 um hoping to get Congressional authorization by 2028 looking at the bottom of the uh of the schedule here um those are the non-federal activities the steering committee developed um a criteria for water needs um that was done back in 20122 and 2023 from that um they agreed upon a process in which they would determine capacity allocations in the new verie space um not knowing what the federal interest is right now they did um allocate 100% of the new verie space uh spread amongst the 22 non-federal partners it's understood that um there will be some federal interests so we will go back to the table um to reassess that and re-evaluate that once we know the federal interest um and and I've got a a a slide here in a little bit I'll talk a littleit I'll expand a little bit more on that uh moving forward into 2025 26 and 27 um in parallel with the NEPA and feasibility process we would be working to construct a cost share agreement with a non-federal partners for construction they would be preparing their funding and operating agreements would um uh operating agreement conversations would start taking place so the purpose of this steering committee um the purpose of the steering committee is really to provide guidance and feedback to the Bureau of Reclamation in the feasibility study process there's different goals and objectives that need to be met at various mil Stones throughout the feasibility process so the uh the steering committee would be providing support for that um the steering committee also oversees and um puts together the annual budget um that's voted upon and approved upon by the steering committee and um they provide data and information for any analysis that needs to be done uh both in the appraisal and in the feasibility study um and and really overall just PR providing communication um providing communication from the steering committee some of the decisions that are M being made and then taking it back to their prospective entities so if the town of Cave Creek did decide to become a member um we would ask for them to identify a representative and an alternative uh representative would be would need to be at that director level or above um they would be attending the steering committee meetings uh they would be an advocate for the project they would be receiving all the communication um in regards to the steering committee um and they they would be attending uh quarterly meetings and they work collaboratively with the other steering committee members uh in order to become a participant um that would have to go to the existing um steering committee and they would have to it would go to a formal vote and they would determine whether they would want to accept um any new members into the committee as far as as far as a timeline um again we're looking to issue the noi in the November time frame so we would be looking if the town of cap Creek was interested in joining we would be asking for a letter of intent that shows uh that you have approval from the Town Council and that you have funds to be able to um uh support um the the project um we we would ask for that um probably in uh the September time frame uh that would go to the committee for a vote if they did vote Yes then we would have a subcommittee that would work with the Cave Creek um representative to do A needs assessment and understand the allocation that would be requested for for for Cave Creek um again that would go back to the overall committee and they would vote on that as well in the um November meeting the November meeting I think is middle of November November 14th if I remember correctly um so between now and then we would need to get that letter of intent um we would have to go through a vote and we would have to do that needs assessment and allocation assessment uh prior to the meeting in November November 14 so pretty quick pretty tight timeline um but um it can be done um uh it just we would have to work closely with you to to kind of get through that that quick turnaround and that quick that tight timeline uh as far as funding for the steering committee um there's two different levels there's a voting member and there's a non- voting member um the voting members vote on items like the budget the annual budget uh changes to changes to the budget um they voted on processes such as um the needs assessment the allocation process that they're following um so more process driven um they uh budget driven and then also they vote on um the membership new members uh entering in as participants um this slide here shows the funding um differences between a voting member and non- voting member the total project projected commitments um for the voting member is 682,000 and the non- voting member is 205,000 uh those are projected commitments um because um we are currently looking at a change order which is shown on that last column there the projected future invoices and so we're finalizing some of those costs um so there may be slight uh slight variations in that those projected future invoices um the first invoice whether you're a voting member or non- voting member would be 300,000 or 90,000 that would be what the current 22 non-federal Partners have been build over the first three years um we would invoice that within um 30 days of um you become becoming a member um and then there would be another invoice in the spring time frame for the federal fiscal year 20125 they 100,000 or 30,000 um the projected future invoices again are based on some additional activities that needed to be performed in the feasibility study and we're working with the Bureau of Reclamation to finalize those we're working with some of our contractors to finalize cost so um we should have a better understanding of some of the those final numbers here within the next month again that would go to a vote in the November meeting with the 22 non-federal Partners um but those the uh future invoices would be spread out over um two F Federal fiscal years over 2026 and 2027 so the initial invoice would be for um everything for the first three years there would be a spring invoice for the federal fiscal year 2025 and then subsequent um subsequent invoices in 2026 and 2027 for those additional scope increases so so as far as allocation um again the ver the new ver space is what what we're focused on right now um the 22 non-federal part Partners have gone through the needs assessment an allocation of the new ver space and it's 100% allocated to the 22 non-federal Partners it's understood work in talking with the Bureau of Reclamation they will there will be some federal interest in that new ver space allocation we're expected to get um have a better we're expected to get a decision on that from them in the at the beginning of September um at that time the subcommittee will go back and they will start reassessing their allocation if the town of Cave Creek did decide to join at that time we would also be assessing kind of what that um what that allocation would be for Cave Creek and what the impacts would be to the other 22 non-federal Partners so that that's sort of the tight timeline that we're working on is in that late September October time frame is kind of finalizing those allocations um to bring that to the boote in in November the November 14th meeting I think that's all I have as far as allocation and the steering committee but um I'm sure we had some questions yeah yep so so so the group can can you know open it up to questions is this a good time for that yep okay would this presentation be available for us uh yeah we we can provide it yeah I've got the slides we'll actually make it available we got them last night I just start off with a general question that being a phoenix and Arizona native wh why are um non SRP customers being allowed to participate at all and thinking well you'd probably have enough demand from the existing SRP the service areas and customers to handle it and water is going to be short in Arizona it's a similar oh council member um mayor sorry will will you complete with your question yeah what what why uh why are people from outside the SRP service area and outside the sphere of of SRP without connections to SRP at all even considered for participation thank you for the question mayor um it's similar to that Phoenix gate water that I mentioned at Horseshoe so at that time in the 1940s uh City of Phoenix built the gates on horseshoe that then allowed that water to be considered off project and so SRP currently the way that our water is delivered to our shareholders is based off of the lands that were used against collateral for the federal government to build Roosevelt Dam so that's what we consider the on Project shareholders so what we're talking about here is an investment infrastructure that would classify the water as off projects similar to what city of Phoenix did in the 1940s at Horseshoe uh for what we are now calling the Phoenix gatewater credits so who and if I was uh anywhere else around and I wanted to be on would I be a candidate for admission I mean I I looked at the list and you know most of the cities and uh are in there I I I'm just trying to understand um and it it and it follows in the question of the allocations which is a real key question for me is um I'm sure you're GNA be overallocated I mean I'm sure I I don't know but I would think you'd be overallocated so um why wouldn't the existing members and SRP just keep this all for themselves well mayor Morris um you know we do have um communities that we want to support and um there are we have the electrical infrastructure as well um so in order to expand our electrical systems to support some of those communities it's going to require water as well and so um it it it would be more of a benefit to us to be able to provide water to those customers that are also power power users as well um to be able to support growth in in those communities we don't get power from you yeah and and mayor Morris we are able to meet the needs of our shareholders um throughout the next hundred years so looking at that hydrology um that that triangle graph I had with the the blue yellow green figure um so we are still able to meet our needs for water um if you remember Kyle's picture the we've pretty much had the same demand um in SRP and we don't anticipate that changing especially as more and more a converts to Municipal um so we have this consistent demand where it's it's an interesting uh perspective that we're in right because SRP um you know we we could have taken it but we don't need to so it's better to offer to the community that we live in um for potential other water Cuts as well as uh groundwater use we we see those two very large needs with the non-federal partners that are interested in this water um so we are confident that we are able to meet our SRP shareholders as well as provide this as a resource so will the new customers have the same prior priority standing as the as older customers or is there a a difference in priority great question mayor Morris uh Arizona Water law is a first and time first and right state so the priority system is based off of um the first priori so the SRP is the oldest priority on the verie Watershed the new verie space would be junior priority and that's why it's shown at the top of the dam um in all the pictures so that's it's it's a similar um stepped up allocation where the the dam acrs uh along the side so there's a shortage each of the 22 people new partners would each have their allocation or some kind of U they'd be equal in priority as far as getting a piece of whatever was available there is a lot of complexity to how the water was allocated um it's primarily based off of need um so you know all of the cities and other um entities submitted their um requests for for water the the need is greater than the water available um so the criteria that was established by the steering committee and was voted on um looked at you know what is basically the fairest way to do this so SRP did not you know give these guidelines these were decided upon the steering commit this this was the thing that was primarily voted on was how do you have so many different entities with so many different interests so many different sizes um that all have this interest in this water um what does this process look like and it is a lengthy lengthy document of how this Al public that we can get a copy of that if you are interested in joining it would be something that you would have to see in order to see you know what allocation you're you're interested in and mayor moris um that that's the process once this goes to a vote and Cave Creek is voted in then we would go through the needs assessment and the allocation process and so we will be able to provide you those documents we will be able to walk you through that process um but it requires the town of cap creep being um voted in in as a member then we start then that kind of kicks off that process that we would we have to have some kind of idea how much water was available wouldn't we to I mean to make a decision a financial decision usually have some kind of idea what the reward is which is which would be part of the whole process um so that's to Jacob's point there would be a a voting in based off of the other steering committee members um and yeah it's there's a lot of interest in the water but there there is still a process at play here and there is still the abil ability to be a part of this process so you wouldn't cash the check until we saw the numbers I guess so I guess I guess as far as funding if you become a steering committee if you become a a participant um you we would go through the process of putting it to a vote to the steering committee then we would go through the needs assessment we would go through the allocation assessment then it would go to another vote to finalize the allocation for the new verie space at that time you know once all parties are happy or are you know are in agreement then then that's when the billing and invoicing would start so it doesn't it doesn't start at at at that those initial stages once so you're not going to take a check home tonight I guess I'm going to open this up to the council Council got I've got a couple questions um so we're not in the verie river system how would we get the water out of the B Lake damp Improvement so um yeah that that's a good question council member roads um it would so we we don't Supply water to um the the the different cities um the city would be responsible for getting acquiring the water and getting it up your infrastructure into into Cave Creek um the next presentation that anony is going to give is going to talk about a facility that we're um looking at constructing that may help and may assist in that process are are you tied into the salt to the central Arizona project because they already have a distribution system I mean that would seem to be like a no-brainer to me so so currently we're not currently we can um accept water from capap um but we can't exchange water in the other direction but the project that Anthony is going to talk about here in a little bit is um an interconnection project between SRP and capap where we would be able to deliver water into their system okay that answer my question as long as you can deliver it into the system and we can do the water offsets I mean that's normal normal way of doing business in Arizona uh council member Ela is on the line there uh Paul if you have any questions jump in maybe give you an opportunity now since you're remote well thanks and the question that I have is um and this is on the allocation um there are 22 people or 22 groups looking at uh a a fixed amount of water and um so if they I guess by a vote invite another organization in [Music] um what they're they're going to put their current allocation at risk for reduction to a to account for a new member in the group I mean help me understand the I guess the politics of this mayor council you are correct um and we we have brought in I would like to point out we did bring in a late member as well um Carefree they did join last year so we we have been through this process already where a lot of these questions came up from the other non-federal partners um we are about to go through another reallocation if there's a federal water interest as well so the entire time that we've been throughout this process we do message every time that this is being 100% allocated without the environmental process starting off which means one there is the opportunity for new members to come in into the federal water interest can also come in so these are points that we have made every time and we did see the same questions and same discussions when Carefree joined and they they were able to join so I can't say with certainty it's a yes or no but we have been through this process before um and we we would hope that they would allow another member can you give me a wild approximation of the amount of water we're talking about for allocation uh great question mayor councel so that would be part of the need assessment that Cave Creek would have to go through so what all the cities did is they um you know basically looked at their Colorado supplies they looked at their groundwater supplies and there's different criteria based off of you know different say cuts to the Colorado system different um you know needs for groundwater so it's it's hard to sum up in in a sentence but that that is part of the process right so you could go in with a number in mind or you could go through the needs process to figure out where you fit in um either option is available um by who the federal interests are uh we do not know at this time there so somebody's just saying that there's Federal interest but you don't know who that is uh so the uh partnership with Reclamation um so this is a feasibility study with the Bureau of Reclamation uh so part of their process is looking at if there is any federal water needs that would be need to be met as part of this project so we do not have any Clarity at this time because they are hoping to get it to us in early September oh they're going to get a share if they would like to this is which brings up the the Indian the lawsuit that you just we've heard about uh are you lawyer to mayor council at this time I I cannot say what their interest is um you know we we feel like there is likely an interest um just because you know it's not very common that new projects come along with with a new water source such as a dam um if that is the option that has chosen is part the feasibility study uh but at this time we we are speculating as well okay yeah mayor Morris I just want to add um we are working with Reclamation um we did we have been asking kind of for a timeline as to when we would know the that Federal interest um they they're targeting September 1st um we don't have um we don't really have an indication how much they're going to be asking for or how much they're going to be requesting um so it it's we are kind of working with them as far as the timing but as far as some of the information background information we won't know that for probably a couple weeks still okay I have another process question on your fact sheet that that we have before us has SRP done something like this before yes in the 1990s you modified Roosevelt Dam along the Salt River for $430 million um this current process involves stakeholders did that work audience so mayor and Council so the the 1995 modification of Roosevelt dam was indeed funded through Partnerships through some non-federal entities along with the Bureau of Reclamation so through that process additional storage was created much like this study we're going through on Bartlett Dam where in turn the partners received percentage allocation of that new space that was created based on their funding mechanism so the funding uh for this current project what is it being used for right now so good question mayor and Council So currently we have a feasibility study authorized by Congress uh which is as Olivia mentioned it's a $28 million study half of it's funded by the Bureau of Reclamation the other half is through the non-federal partners as required by the federal government strictly getting a study created to present alternatives for Congress to consider how which is the best means to address the siment mitigation efforts on the birdie system so I will say congress eventually has the official approval of What alternative to go with you know so is there some risk of spending money on a study and the result comes back from Congress to the Bureau of Reclamation that they only approve dredging of Sho Dam that's that's a possibility but that's why you go through a study the whole NEPA process to V out all those items and issues and present that entire paperwork through the bureau to Congress for their consideration so we can't stand here today and say we're going to do X Y or Z specifically because that will be eventually be up to Congress so $28 million is all to do research to do a study and prepare it and do Environmental Studies and reports and do a public awareness and seek public comment all for that effort to go to Congress correct it has nothing to do with one drop of water it is to on paper allocate but that risk is it may not happen okay very good thank you so assuming Congress probably a 99% that they will U what's the timeline after that what how long is it going to take to build the dam how long how how long is it going to take to fill the reservoir and when would that water begin to be available mayor council so we are hoping to get the feasibility study to Congress by the end of 2027 we would hope that they would approve quickly but we have no certainty on how long it takes them to appropriate and authorize a project um based on what is going on in Congress at that time again we we would hope it would go quickly from there uh it would have to go to uh further design level so it's currently at a 30% engineering design of the two Dam Alternatives that's part of the feasibility study so it would have to go through final design um and then Construction Construction is anticipated about five years in duration for for the largest dam um it would be slightly less for the the smaller Dam Rays um so we would anticipate you know if we were able to do some type of um you know lumped construction engineering contract where we could move some of these process a little further probably six to seven years after Congress approves to to get that engineering design as well as construction complete and then how long to fill the reservoir just a guess on average that is very dependent on the hydrology understand I mean given there are some historical records here and there's an average I'm sure that comes in yeah great question I will have to get back to you on that okay Tom have you looked at the idea that what is lost from the Verity system by overflow is then going into your aquifer and then becomes available to you as groundwater great question mayor council we are looking at that as part of the impact of the feasibility study so what you're referring to is the spill events that happen on the verie system um to our point you know it's 12% of our storage but 40% of the inflow so that that does happen um so so we will be studying those impacts through NEPA but do not have that answer at this time does staff have any uh questions I'm sorry Tom did yeah yes sir um I just had curiosity does SRP favor one height over the other or are you neutral on that I just was curious if you had a professional reference great question the engineering supports either one um so you know from a from a risk to the current Dam or the dam Upstream that was our interest is so I i' mentioned how 101.8 is the absolute tallest it can be without impacting the dam above we are obviously very interested in that Dam above um not being impacted so either one uh supports it's good good uh Rock quality on site to support a dam Foundation mayor council I guess to add to that that's all part of the feasibility study as well um we're going to go through um each alternative and from an engineering design standpoint from an environmental standpoint from a cultural standpoint um there's a lot of a lot of factors involved and so um going through that complete analysis will help us determine what is the best alternative so um it's kind of hard to answer that question today until we get through all of the feasibility study um you know we may may have a preference today but as we go through the feasibility study um we may encounter cultural environmental concerns that you kind of steer us away from that alternative so um I guess it I guess to answer that it would be hard to answer today but that's part of the feasibility process um another question for you everybody everyone's familiar with the concept of you know pay to play to me what's more fascinating than how much water the town could eventually the region up here could eventually get from this type of inclusion is really more of the status of the town's relationship with SRP and especially in the future I think future policy on water in the state will be largely led by SRP just as electric generation is led by APS and its relationship with the regional producers and so forth and it would be a shame to miss this opportunity and end up like Rio verie who have to have water cobbled together at the legislature and Beyond to serve the people in that region it seems to me the opportunity for inclusion in this confederation is priceless beyond the water because it gives us infrastructure access that we would never be able to even closely and especially down the road when membership will not be open this boat is the the whistle has blown and the Gang plank because one left on the on the Harbor it just seems like the timing could not be more fortunate but even more important for me at least than the water that would be delivered would be the protection of the organization and especially SRP in particular uh in the years ahead so I think there's a water benefit I think there's a policy benefit in the near term but I think there's predictive protection for this part of Maricopa County and in this Incorporated area in particular and for our Twin City care free to be ahead of us on that I think we ought to hasten to try to catch up that's just my person any other staff Ernie yeah um of the 22 Partners you have here how many are voting great question we will have to get back to you on that I will say most are voting we've got a handful of non- voting um so it it most are voting but it would not be uncharacteristic to be a non- voting member okay Council if you don't mind it's roughly it's 13 or 14 voting members so we can get you the exact number but um next question I've heard something about you running into a problem with birds or something in the in the dam location and and having to think about a different spot is that that's that's my uh great question mayor council so we we had alluded to um part of the feasibility study potentially needing more funding um that is for or something called a trial Quarry uh where we are going to test the rock that exist at the uh Reservoir that would then be used to build the dam potentially so we are we are studying the feasibility of that process um so there were some environmental restrictions that we did have to accommodate um at this time so that would not impact the feasibility of the dam but does impact our ability to get out there and get some rocks but we did find a solution and we have moved forward uh that work will take place this fall Okay so I'm gonna te I don't know that I see enough gray hair up there for this question I don't have hair to begin with well yeah I'm I'm working I think we got the same Barber um way back I mean Sal River Project has a rather contentious relationship with two organizations one of which is the Udan society and the other is the uh um Sierra Club going back in the recesses of my mind did did you were you under a federal order at one time horseshoe to have a maximum pool that you could maintain because some silly bird nested in the dead trees so mayor and Council we do have what we call a habitat conservation plan at Horseshoe to account for some biological uh Critters to maintain a habitat at Horseshoe so through an environmental process that came out that we need to modify by how the Horseshoe is operated and make sure we have a certain levels there to provide a habitat for them okay so so your numbers for total storage I would assume that that the flood plane that backed up behind the dam your your area that you're you're talking about maintaining habitat yeah mayor and counsel that's why that's why you dump water out a horseshoe so fast whenever it come whenever it comes in because you you have to do that maintain that environmental plan so that and addition to the sediment not being able to store so correct yeah you can't launch a boat up there it's way too muddy right right yeah and so with this study I will add that we recognize and we've already engaged in conversations with those environmental entities there's going to be land that's going to be inundated if Congress passes one of these damn Alternatives so we already having conversations about what that looks like but that official process will happen when we do the kickoff in November with a notice of intent to start the two plus year NEPA process as required for any federal project yeah so I I guess I guess the reason I'm asking those question it appears to me there's an awful lot of unknowns at this point in time that are that are that are pretty scary uh you know first of all M depending on on on water the water shed actually delivering the delivering the water and you've got a tremendous um ver verie Watershed is is is pretty darn big and you're missing some other tributaries but I don't want to talk about them uh all right thank you that I guess it that's the end of my questions mayor council just add again going back to the feasibility study that that's the purpose of the feasibility study we are going to look at some of those environmental concerns we are going to look at some of those cultural concerns um what the impacts will be so we may not have the answers today but that's part of the process that's part of going through the Neer process that's part of going through the Fe feasibility study um that's a two-year process so it's going to develop over time before we have some of those answers yeah historic historical P perception would would for me would be that you're going to get to deal with those two those two entities again because they're always negative on the completely agree mayor and Council and we're open open and welcome to that again Bureau of Reclamation will be joining us in those conversations and those public outreaches and answering those questions and going through what mitigations have to take place if this project is approved to accommodate certain archaeological cultural habitat sites so yes y'all did a great job on Roosevelt there's a lot more places to bass fish now um I have a question I have a I I have a question about Roosevelt if I may um it sounds like this project sort of is the same uh process uh in terms of putting a dam together and I know nothing about dams but I do know that um it's a it's a big system and I'm Wonder um what is it what is it um what does it cost to run that thing and is that uh something we should be looking at in terms of future liability we're a town that operates on sales tax and uh I don't know what does it cost to run Roosevelt is that a money-making proposition so mayor and Council um the federal government owns the assets uh by contract with the federal government we operate maintain and Care those systems for them on our on our behalf so if talking about cost to operate and maintain a system that's all on SRP to do because of our contract with the Bureau of Reclamation so to be part of the water Fe X many dollars per acre foot right that's what we would get charged the password I believe when we go through the cost allocation or the cost share agreement with all the partners I don't know if that's a good question I don't know if maintenance is part of that analysis or not if it's just pure construction of the dam I'm sure though that if you're going to pump water into the system we're going to have to pay for the water part of paying for the water is m maintaining the the resource so it'll it'll be built into the cost I'm pretty sure we'll take a look at that the federal government has guidelines of what goes into those cost share agreements but we'll get back to you on that along those same lines do you have any idea what the cost per acref foot might be for any additional Water Supplies great question at this time we are waiting for the updated cost estimate so as I mentioned we are in in 30% design as part of the feasibility study so um we have the number from the appraisal study uh which was 1.2 billion that was a class 5 estimate so that's a very high level not a lot of information we are anticipating our class three estimate based off the 30% design in midt so that's when we would have that cost of what it will be for the feasibility study of what is assumed to be the full Dam construction and that will be conveyed to all of the non-federal partners for that answer of what is that cost per acre foot okay thank you yes question um Kyle Jacob um I'm not sure it came up during our discussion a couple weeks ago but I think it's important for the council to hear so process-wise if we were to join the um Consortium or the U be one of the uh non-governmental non-federal Partners um I think what I heard was as part of the feasibility study it comes back and you're at a point where you've gone and you you know you're about to go out to do an RFP for the construction of this there's an opportunity for an out one last opportunity for us to get out and I I think that's important in this process because you know these could be very scary numbers we're only a community of about 5,000 people we have a very water small water system so I I think we've heard a lot about risks today and we there's a lot of unknowns but I would say and I would tell you I think that's one of the best takeaways here is that if we were to do the front end which is could be very costly for this potential investment um there is a potential for us to get out if we decided after seeing some scary cost that it wasn't like something we wanted to pursue so I just I just wanted to ver is that is that absolutely correct mayor and Council we are only committed with the federal government to do this study there will be a completely new separate cost share agreement to finish design and construction after Congress approves the alternative that they want us to pursue at that time Partners would need to consider if they're in based on the alternative proved by Congress and the costs associated with that alternative to continue on at the allocation that was approved by Congress or not so beyond the study There's an opportunity to not continue P that point once Congress approves would the bureau still contribute 50% so the Bureau of Reclamation because it's a they're the lead Agency on this they have they must design and construct it they must own the contract to design and construct the facility because it's their asset so that we as SRP acting on behalf of the non-federal partners will enter into a new cost share agreement with them once Congress approves it then we will know how the cost share agreement will work between the non-federal part ERS so we don't know at this point in time but they will have some ownership theau absolutely correct yes they have to otherwise Congress can't get correct funding or can't provide any funding I see our water attorney would like to ask a question Michelle I had two questions based on what I heard before that I thought everybody might want to hear I'll ask both questions and then you guys can answer the first question is to ask whether any um projections of probability of availability have been made based on damned water for instance the plan six capacity at Roosevelt isn't available every year because there's not enough water in the system to satisfy all the demands that have priority and so I think it's important to understand if there was an allocation of water how often do we think it might be available that's the first question this the second question I'm really not sure the answer Sean may know but we have heard that you may need to also buy into the skiff in order to transport water from one system to another I know that this town would have to have a partner that we'd have to develop to actually get the water because we don't have a physical way to get it but is there a requirement to also get into the giift process so I'll take the first question if you want want to take the second okay um so the the first question was about um you know how do you know that if you build a dam that you have the water available and can you show that you have the water available so that is part of the climate change and hydrology technical analysis as part of the feasibility study is we are looking at how climate change is going to impact the hydrology in the future and what does that mean for CRS on a dam um so we what we're talking about is that new verie space and that that again that triangle graph I wish I could I could pull it back up um the verie system is very volatile so we have those years of drought but we have those years of extreme inflow so the dam would allow you to capture those years of extreme um runoff and we we do see acrs happening throughout but it is it is a balance of the wet and dry that new ver space is about a 3.5 to1 capacity to yield ratio so many people that are interested in a specific amount of water um you know if you only wanted 500 acre feet if that's all you bought it could not be guaranteed at 500 acre feet per year because of the hydrology and that balance of the wet and dry so what many partners are doing is um 3.5 times whatever they're interested in to make sure that water is available based off of the average annual yield so this dam is appropriately sized for the hydrology it is a good balance of the wet and dry um but you know building a bigger Dam at this point would not give more water but the hydrology does support the dam that we do have I'll take the second question Jacob so no you uh being a partner to this project does not automatically need you to be a partner to the skiff project we have way less Partners on the skiff project than we do with this feasibility study there in is an opportunity to council members comment before SRP could help facilitate discussions if you're a member of the Bartlet project only we could help facilit discussions on water exchanges with other entities that you can exchange your allocation of water with someone else that whether we use our infrastructure or not and help arrange where water could get into let's say the capap canal Upstream of you or what have you and we're happy to facilitate those discussions like we do today with many of our SRP customers and non SRP customers so the answer is no you don't have to be partner to both just add to that we actually do have a quick presentation about the ski project and there's actually a video that helps explain those water exchanges so for the town's benefit um if we move forward with the Bartlet Dam discussion and and agree to move forward with that project it may make sense uh for us to actually join this gift project to allow us that flexibility of the water exchanges on the cap water and the the graphics actually explain that very well so I'll let that one we'll let that run a minute I did have a couple of questions just to confirm the action for our c tonight is we have a short fuse if we want to move ahead with this just want to make sure I've got the numbers right is it $25,000 total in or is it the um the projected future invoices for the change or we on top of that so we talking a $290,000 commitment yes so mayor and councel so Sean yes so if you're if you like to be interested in being a non-voting member the total commitment that we would ask out of Cave Creek is $25,000 so that would include the four year of $30,000 each plus the change order amount roughly in the amount of 85,000 which equates to the 205 okay thank you and again the last change order amounts could be paid over the two fiscal years in 26 and 27 if need be so that would be the total and then future construction costs there's too many variables at this point you know something similar to when the central Arizona project was constructed that was funded by federal dollars and then the capital costs are being repaid by the users as it goes for is there any hope of mechanism like that or for a small agency like us will there be a fairly Hefty Bill to be paid up front for the project or that's all unknown at this point so mayor and Council um you Sean yeah so okay I don't know if I can pronounce your last name it takes a while okay so that is the beauty of the cost share agreement we when we get to that point I mean there is probably a draft template the federal government would like us to use between SRP and them yeah and how it works with the non-federal partners we could probably write in any terms and conditions that talk about payment plans and of that nature much like we did with this feasibility study and how we did four years of a of a financial commitment that that's nice because yeah again hearing a 1.2 million cost assestment with a level five just scares me a little B for small agency it's hard for small so that's something uh if the town elects to move forward with this and town staff will provide a recommendation is you know that it's $225,000 commitment right now now for the next uh three years to make to get us a seat at the table or something that so that actually is more palatable I think so it's we'll provide staff recommendation in the future we have to figure this out you know as we presented the council before you know our water future is very uncertain right now and as we've mentioned last year uh when we presented the D master plan and then what we'll present in a couple of weeks the final master plan the the town is is in a situation with the shortages and the reallocation on the Colorado River of having to find new water resources you know knowing that this is best case scenario uh 2032 to 2035 time frame that does put us in a situation we got to fill in that Gap still but it might be a solution for us but there's a lot of unknowns too and there's a lot of cost but nothing with water is going to be cheap so it's something that we have to look look forward to okay uh are we ready to move to the next presentation about the SK ski is ski is that do we have another one coming yeah I would recommend um do you want to do the the video first one yeah I think the video helps explain big picture and then we'll have a quick couple slides after that we have one more question I got got one more question for you um looking looking through your documentation I don't see any mention of hydroelectric so that's not part of the project is that sorry I didn't question electric I thought you heard a I heard fiveyear electric sorry mayor council um so there is a small microturbine currently on the dam that provides sight power that will continue throughout the project um but basically a fees study is so complex for the Alternatives that we have that it was decided to put hydroelectric uh Provisions for the future if desired but in order to move this process through Congress and through feasibility study um there are no uh lines out there currently so you would have to go through all the sighting studies as well so it's just it's better to have Provisions now to allow for in the future is what we decided plan it ahead so at a at a later date SRP could actually put the turbines in and generate okay okay well thank you very much very interesting as as you can tell we're all highly interested engag yeah so the next um the video is about 10 minutes in length and then there's a couple of slides to follow up um that uh would the project manager uh can help explain the skip project a little bit more and then I think at that we can add more Council discussion and then open it up to the public questions Arizona's water history is distinguished by the impact of strategic water infrastructure the key to unlocking the full potential of that infrastructure is the interconnection between existing facilities maximizing the use of existing facilities affords the greatest return on investment while providing the greatest Water Resource benefit for SRP shareholders and Regional Partners one example is the interconnection between the Salt River Project and the central Arizona project Water Systems delivering a combined 2.3 million acre feet per year to over 5 million arizonans SRP and capap manage the water resources that support Central Arizona's economy the capap water system begins with intake pumps at Lake Havasu that divert Colorado River water into the capap canal with a capacity of 3300 cubic feet per second the capap canal transports about 1.5 million acre feet of Colorado River water per year from there the water is pumped hundreds of miles across central Arizona for delivery to Municipal industrial and agricultural users from Phoenix to Tucson after crossing the valley the canal approaches the capap Salt River siphon located just Downstream of the Granite Reef diversion Dam here the open ditch Canal goes underground bringing capap water under the Salt River and srp's Arizona and South canals the pressure created by the siphon pushes the water uphill emerging at the surface on the south side of the Salt River just Downstream is the capap SRP inter connection facility also known as the csif with a total capacity of 1200 cubic feet per second the csif is a one-way interconnection of the capap canal to srp's water delivery system the csif delivers capap water to one of three points either to srp's South Canal to the Salt riverbed or to srp's Arizona canal with these connections capap water can be delivered to any point along more than 12200 M of SRP canals and laterals including recharge facilities and 11 drinking water treatment plants used to provide safe reliable drinking water to the valley in in addition to the treatment plants served from srp's canals there are nine water treatment plants on the capap system in general the water treatment plants on the SRP canals treat SRP water and serve SRP lands while the water treatment plants on the capap system treat capap water and serve areas outside of SRP however there are significant Water Supplies stored underground in srp's service area and in srp's reservoirs intended to serve customers outside of srp's service area currently those supplies can only be delivered to water treatment plants directly connected to srp's delivery system the capability of the connected water treatment plants to push water to areas where it's needed ranges from very limited to non-existent the ability to put water from srp's system into the capap canal would change that in order to facilitate expanded delivery and enhanced resiliency of the Valley's Water Supplies SRP is proposing to construct a new SRP C interconnection referred to as the skiff this interconnection facility will be a critical component of the Valley's water delivery infrastructure located next to the existing interconnection facility the skiff will allow greater flexibility and improved efficiency by delivering the Valley's water supply to where it's needed the facility will consist of a pumping station and a short length of underground pipe connecting srp's South Canal to the capap canal the skiff can be used in a variety of ways to transport water without building extensive and costly additional infrastructure like pipelines and Wells for example using the skiff to deliver water held in the 304,000 acre feet of storage capacity in the new conservation space at Roosevelt Lake elimin the need for additional infrastructure to move this water outside of srp's service area NCS water stored here by Mesa Tempe Chandler Scottdale Phoenix and Glendale is intended for use outside of srp's service area but at present can only be delivered to those cities SRP treatment plants with the skiff in Place Mesa for example could order its NCS water released from Roosevelt Lake have it diverted through the SK and use the capap canal to directly deliver it to mesa's capap water treatment plant for use outside of srp's water service area the skiff can provide the same access for water users located Upstream of the inner connection for example Glendale could order its NCS water released from Roosevelt Lake to be diverted through the skiff and delivered to the capap canal and in turn take delivery of water from the capap canal at its water treatment plant this type of indirect delivery is possible without impacting other cap deliveries and could even provide operational flexibility for the capap during Peak demand periods the skiff could be used in the same way for Phoenix's gatewater and SRP capap water exchange but perhaps its greatest impact will be on the recovery of long-term storage credits stored within srp's Water Service area most of the capap water released to the SRP delivery system has been recharged into underground storage facilities operated by SRP SRP manages three recharge facilities the SRP groundwater savings facility the New River aaia river underground storage project or na USP and the Granite Reef underground storage project or grusp also located within srp's boundaries are several other city-owned recharge projects all together over 1.8 million acre feet of long-term storage credits are currently stored at these facilities these credits are held by Valley Cities the Arizona Water banking Authority the capap SRP and others when needed these credits will be pumped from a well ideally one located within the area where the water was stored SRP has over 27 Wells within its service area that are ideally located for recovering these long-term storage credits but like the surface water stored in srp's reservoirs recovered well water can currently only be delivered using srp's delivery system that presents a problem considering that the vast majority of these credits are intended to meet water needs outside of srp's service area for future growth or for use during a Colorado River shortage here's how this skiff can help with the new interconnection in place cities like Phoenix with over 200,000 acre feet of credits stored within srp's service area can arrange to use srp's Wells for Recovery one or more Wells would pump Phoenix's stored water and deliver it to SRP customers in place of the SRP water they would normally receive the SRP water would instead be diverted into the capap canal using the skip allowing Phoenix to take delivery of an equal amount of water at their capap water treatment plant this same Arrangement can be made with cities located outside of srp's water service area for example Apache Junction has recharged capap water at srp's groundwater savings facility in the future they could use the skiff to obtain direct access to their stored water using srp's Wells capable of recovering water from the area where it was stored Apache Junction would arrange to use srp's Wells for Recovery one or more of srp's Wells would pump the stored water and deliver it to SRP customers in place of the SRP water they would normally receive that water would instead be diverted into the capap canal using the skiff which would flow down to Apache Junction's capap Water Treatment Plant this same Arrangement could also benefit benefit future development in Queen Creek the Santan Valley Superstition Vistas Goodyear and Buckeye through the purchase of existing credits stored within srp's boundaries or for future storage and recovery of newly acquired Water Resources whether for Recovery direct or indirect delivery the skiff offers valuable benefits such as an infrastructure solution that serves the entire Valley and a secure Water Resource Management tool that provides added resiliency for the Valley's Water Supplies being prepared for both future growth and water supply shortages requires Regional cooperation just as it did to build both the Salt River Project and the capap interconnections between water systems like the skiff are necessary to maximize efficiencies of existing infrastructure and facilitate flexible water delivery systems that can adapt to changing conditions Arizona's water history is distinguished by the impact of strategic water infrastructure and that remains true today Arizona's future will require the same types of investment in water infrastructure to maintain Dependable access to renewable supplies in increasingly uncertain times um of like ask transit for water did you have some uh presentation to go along with this or yes yes so uh I'm Anthony Beckham I'm the skiff project manager just want to say it's an honor to be here before the Cave Creek committee today actually grew up in Cave Creek so happy to be here do we get a discount if I could so I think the video took a lot of my thunder away um but really just wanted to talk about the project and the process for joining um if Cave Creek decides to um go that route um so as a video mentioned there is an existing connection from the cap system to srps Canal system and that is the capap SRP interconnection facility um the facility that we're here to talk about today is the skiff or the SRP capap interconnection facility and it's it's very common to mix those up and we do it all the time at SRP so and and just talking about a couple aspects of the skiff um so the alignment has changed you might notice um as working with capap on the design uh there's some engineered fill material around the capap canal and that's why the alignment has changed um but it also um there's a fair amount of lift involved about 150 to 200 feet of lift at this point in time um so there will be a requirement of a sub station to power pumps to transport that water uphill um in terms of the benefits of the the skip facility um it's a strategic interconnection for increased Regional operational flexibility um it physically connects SRP system to C Canal um it enables Direct Delivery Downstream in exchanges with Upstream entities including main stem on the Colorado River um and then also to water treatment plants recharge facilities um there's also firming opportunities um and utilizing new development like the new verie space um it also improves the ability to use non-project water from SRP system um so as noted in the video two of those supplies are in existence today um so we have the Roosevelt temporary deviation space um don't want to go too far into the weeds but I can tell you there's a space uh flood control space that once water enters into that space we have to follow a a manual from the Army Corps of Engineers for for safety reasons um we got a five foot uh deviation in that space so usually we have to evacuate that space within 20 days and the first five feet of that space we're able to extend our releases to 120 days so we have a pilot program so to speak for about five years um where we can slowly release and safely um that five five fet of space when it fills with water in Roosevelt um so the other one is the new conservation space which is described in the video um and I know there's some earlier discussion um one of the things I just wanted to highlight is you know most of the water rights in SRP system are tied to the land um over time there's been infrastructure improvements to the dam which enable additional storage within our Reservoir system so with those supplies that were kind of added to our project over time those supplies can be moved outside of srp's water service area um we also have long-term storage credits which is those water C water um and effluent in some cases that's been stored underground in srps groundwater savings facility essentially our Irrigation District boundary and then also our constructed recharge facilities um and then like I mentioned earlier uh the new birie space would be another um potential Supply that could be moved through the ski and then just just a status update um so right now uh we have about 12 participants on the project including capap and SRP and we're in the 30% design phase and we're um we're planning to complete that by September um so it's a little bit different process compared to the new birie space where the project participants are taking the the risk themselves and they're they're paying for this at this point in time there's no federal dollars that are matching uh the money that they're putting into the project um so the first agreement that we have with the participants are specifically for 30% engineering design um in the second agreement which we're currently drafting will be to cover uh the Environmental Compliance or the NEPA um which we anticipate uh submitting the noi November similar to Bartlett and that would be about a two-year process um and so the NEPA would probably kick off in January February timeline um and two years from there is when we would anticipate to be able to start construction um so I don't have a a schedule but but I can talk high level um so two years from January February timelines uh gets us to um 2027 and so we have roughly about three years of construction for the facility and so we're we're planning to complete just before 2030 um to have the facility in place um so at this point in time there is not federal funding but there is an opportunity to and um we've been talking to the grants program under the um lower Colorado River Basin conservation efficiency program um so there's two different buckets some of those are for short-term conservation efforts among water users in the capap system um the second one's for longer term term uh conservation efforts um so the bucket two is the one that we're currently examining and working with our stakeholders and looking at um in terms of the costs um the most recent costs that we've shared with our participants for construction design um different construction Management Services uh from external entities uh that would be required for construction of the facility is about 177 million if you're looking at the cost per acref foot uh it's around 180,000 acre feet or 500 CFS is the design of the facility um so the cost per acre foot is around a th000 uh I would probably use ,000 to $1,500 an acre foot um for that cost um in terms of the process uh for becoming uh a ski participant or participant in the project um there's a the current agree agement that we have with the participants has a specific Clause that addresses the process for joining um so additional parties similar to Bartlett will be added by majority of vote um there's a process where the if K prek wanted to join we would request a letter of interest um from Cave Creek and then we would bring that to our skiff participants at one of our scheduled meetings um and the depending on when you join so at this point we're pretty close to finishing the 30% design there is a risk premium of 20% that the other participants um uh kind of took by by completing the 30% design phase so there there's multiple phases where if you wanted to join you could but you would have to incur that 20% risk premium and that's really all I have for today I'll welcome any questions last how many other agencies are currently participating in this GIF um so so there's uh 12 uh participants so 11 technically if you include cap and then there's 10 Municipal entities so some are cities and then there's uh yeah couple others thank you would would outside uh if if you're not a par participant will you uh will will there be a schedule of cost to still transfer water uh mayor mayor Morris uh yes there there would be a cost um and and we can provide that even if you're not a participant we'd have to walk through what that looks like um with our participants and and I'm saying that because we we have some cost figures that we're looking at have to share to our participants first yeah the Coster is isn't important what is is concept that that Outsiders can use it you know the people that that own it ought to get something for that just like anything else but uh uh I mean I'm since we're so U on the Upstream side here it seemed like we would have a fairly easy time exchanging uh capap water or verie river water or capap water um there'd be a lot of potential Partners maybe that's a better way to say it mayor Morris I I think that's correct um I also don't want to be toned deaf so we've talked about the engineering design of the facility and right now we're working with C on the water quality efforts um so there are standards within the C system in how and when um that water can be moved uh so the capacity of 500 CFS that we have right now is based on six months of operation um so that'd be primarily during summer months and that's based on the arsonic conditions um in the birie system what is the arsic there it it's just naturally occurring I mean the the the percentage the PPM ppb whatever the I mean how how Clos is drinking water standard which is what 12 16 Sean 10 drinking water standard is 10 milligrams per liter so I guess the question is you know how yeah I've heard that too so um because of the arsic that comes off FY River I don't sure if you guys know that that there you're limited to only a six-month window of getting deliveries through the the the skiff of our water resources and and that's that's correct that's something that we're working through with cap to understand what that can look like there is the possibility that maybe a lower flow amount can move the other six months out of the year but it's something that we're still examining with cap but but for now to be conservative because the the Arsenic standards or the Arsenic that we're seeing wouldn't comply with the standards that capap is I'm not even sure why we would need to be in the GI or ever use it I'm I'm I mean we all we get cap water and um it would seem to me that we there are so many potential Partners around that you could give the birdie river water to and just translate that into cap water which essentially is everybody else around so Anthony you know my mayor and Council so correct you do not need to be a part of skip you could do an exchange of some user Downstream of your water and through that effort then they would offer some water Upstream like for like to come into your uh turnout on the cap Canal to your system so that is part of the luxury of we can help navigate that with you and other entities Downstream so like from Bartlett to City of Surprise is a partner on Bartlett but not on skip they're GNA have to work out some exchange agreements to get water to surprise in exchange for their water in the nvs space so you can get creative on exchanges to facilitate getting water to your in your intake and not necessarily need to be part of skip to do that is is Phoenix aart skip yes okay um questions from Council staff oh yeah so I'm just to wrap this out or TR to wrap my head around some of this stuff so two things that I heard um that came out earlier and I think I've I've learned about it so if we wanted to participate in the Bartlet there's a cost to get through the study and then because of the averaging of the storage um since we're wrapping up the master plan we'd be looking to probably get between 500 and 1,000 acre feet to make it to to help short up the town's Water Supplies so what I heard on the Bartlet side of the equation is that we'd have to ask to make sure we can get that available on an average year we have to ask for 3.5 uh times that so I think it's 1,750 to 3500 ACR F feet of water so that's that's our participation in Bartlett and then with the skiff if we were to join the skiff that would give us access to the transportation between and that would help facilitate our Arrangements but that the skiff is limiting into a to deliver that through a a six-month window right now at this point so we have to factor those two things in sort of adds to our cost and the, to $1,500 per acre foot you're thinking of right now is that the con was that the construction estimate at this point that's correct okay so our participation for the town to join right now what would that be like similar to what was brought out in the presentation of Bartlet where that's a $25,000 fee for the next uh one time and then the ongoing for the next two years what would that be for these the gift project so so I can I can give you a range in a ballpark of figes um and it depends on which amount you choose if you know you talked about 500 to a th000 acre feet so if you're using the 3.5 Factor that's 1500 to 3500 acre feet um for the 30% design the current agreement with with uh the risk premium you'd probably be looking at 20K for the 1500 acre feet or 4.8 CFS uh in 40K for the 3500 acre feet in 9.7 CFS yeah um for Nea cost we're still working through what that looks like um but we did provide some figures to our skiff participants so I can give you some ballpark figures based on um the capacity so uh for NEPA you might be looking at 30k on the low end and then 60k um on the upper end for that 3500 acre and then one of the things I didn't also talk about is that so the the engineered design of the facility is 500 CFS right now we have 409 CFS allocated and we do have two additional members that are going to be seeking a vote um the next month but there still is remaining capacity um for for participants to join okay yeah because if I do the math right which I often some mess up for that would mean we would be looking between 4.8 and 9.7 keep per second of capacity so sounds like that's still available to be allocated okay y so just to recap what I heard is uh somewhere between 20 and $40,000 this point for to participate with a follow up Nea study for another 30 to 60 so somewhere between uh30 and $100,000 to participate and then construction uh which is the 100 the the uh 1,000 to, 1500 per construction that's a future cost we'd have to build into this so yeah that's something we have to balance off is it worth us participating that or we just work on Arrangements Downstream to allow for this obviously participating in this gift gives us access to that and helps us par uh but there's a financial cost to doing that so it's something we'll have to go back this GI would be a value if for someone down stream um from Patchy Junction on but it's hard to see where it would well we could just do a separate ex change here without using the skiff at all to in my mind presuming we could identify Partners yeah as as Anthony brought up you know about um surprise is not is not participating in this gift so they're just working on relationships Downstream so that's something as an option when we are Upstream of the the SRP uh capap and Au and for the partners you got to put our our little treatment plant on your maps in the future so we're small but we're important small Port uh we're way up there 12 miles north of the Cal Canal um yeah that's something we'd have to look at and valuate whether it's worth us uh to join the GI it gives us some rights but is it worth it for Value Wiis re work on Partnerships and exchanges okay um any other question staff do you have any is Staff completely so uh process wise um what we're going to do is we're going to bring this back to the next council meeting for us to get your um your decision on this so we don't want to belabor this but that's the process and um we have a pretty good read on on the council um and we'll bring that back it'll be the two pieces I you know we were not aware at the time we put together the staff report for tonight that the skip was going to be part of the discussion I'm glad it was because um I think that's a potentially an important component but as the mayor mentioned there are other Alternatives probably for us to get water if we were in this uh bartl Dam Expansion Project so that's the pro that's the process we'll be coming back to to you um the next meeting in September with decision and um I think what we might do since we need to jump start that is we will likely put theou on and just skip the step with the um letter of intent and then we'll just have the council potentially um act on that we could talk Kyle a little bit about that process how this we have public comment on this but I just before that starts i' like to say that I I really admire what's will SRP has such a history my grandfather worked on on the dam up there uh in t the Tonto Dam back in 1909 or whatever it was but so but but SRP has a history in this state and you know you really are the centerpiece because you you're right in the middle of both systems you're the you're the connecting it's great to see this kind of cooperation and thinking and talk about exchanging water and storing water so I just give all the compliments in the world RP for doing this and i' certainly uh commend you for your presentation tonight it's very very good very high quality and looks like your damn work is pretty high quality too so to your grandfather you know he helped build it so yeah yeah yeah he well I'll tell that story later um we have public comment on this if if we're finished here so have any comments Rudy fiser first out gate thank you mayor council um so you know I haven't seen this presentation about the uh about the SRP project although I've seen I've been watching the the dam um sort of schematics for about a year um and the reason for that is I go to a lot of the capap meetings and M meetings and all the the geeky stuff and one of the reason that's one of the reasons that I'm running for the central Arizona Water Conservation District which is the group that oversees the capap so it was interesting to see the the skiff program because I think it's one of the most exciting projects that they have going in the last 15 or 20 years I think it' be really good um you know one of the things that with water right now and I like I said I see a lot of meetings there are a lot of very smart people looking at not so much the cost of water but the availability and that's going to be the big driving Factor here in Arizona we're in a desert and unfortunately we're kind of reliant on a federal partner who's helped build a lot of projects but they also sort of regulate what we get out of it um and that could be you know it's a little there's the good and there's there's the bad um the you know so I've been on a city council and i' I've served on a waterboard in elected position so I I know where you guys are from coming from you're looking to make sure that the Public's money is being spent the best way that you can spend it but um if you look at the history of things like the SRP project in 1903 or the Hoover Dam or the the 20-year project for the capap the the things that they could do back then were a lot easier and you know I worked with at Beckle with some people who had been on the Hoover Dam um and the story is there I'm just amazed at what they could get away with that they can't now because of safety considerations environmental impact statements that you have to go through um and that's just a part of the process but I I guess I'd sum it up before I take too much time um I think it's it's good consideration of both projects and being involved in it um it's better to be at the table than not um because availability is going to be an issue uh coming down the line um so I'd say give some serious consideration to getting involved with the damn project thank you thank you Mr Fisher Ron SOA mayor vice mayor council members Ron Sova town of Cave Creek Town core resident I know I'm limited to three minutes so I'll try to be very quick I have a lot of questions I know you can't respond to them so I'd ask you to consider the my questions and your analysis of whether you move forward or not uh and my comments are based on the information that was uh provided tonight by SRP and in the packet online and with that I my questions would be uh how much will it cost to move forward I had heard a while back it was going to be 140,000 as a non-voting entity and I've seen with the presentation tonight it would start at 90 and I think an answer to Shan's question it was 205 uh so that's been addressed and then I had a question of the 22 project Partners uh it appeared that only I think it was about uh what was the number about 14 were cities and towns the rest were other agencies and I think that question was answered as to are they all current members of uh SRP and being served so that's been addressed and then of the 28 million feasibility study it was answered that roughly a half of that would be paid for by the feds and my question uh would be what would be cave Creeks anticipated amount should you move forward for the $14 million yet to be spent how would that be allocated between the uh 22 current uh project Partners if that's the right number uh another question was if the projects approved what would be the anticip ipated cost to Cave Creek for the1 billion anticipated cost and along those lines my question is is that million billion excuse me Dollar number in today's dollars or is that a number that has already been adjusted for inflation uh for sometime 10 or 15 or more years from now uh I don't know uh would Cave Creek gain access to SRP water should you move forward uh that question's been addressed and I've learned a lot about the skiff program that sounds like a good program uh and then what might the town's share be to pay the estimated billion dollars and what might the town uh receive for that payment in terms of water uh any additional cost fees or expenses uh I know I'm flashing right if I could have 30 more seconds I'll be done uh and I'm always skeptical of any government especially the fed's ability to complete any project on time and on budget uh so these numbers I question what the real numbers are going to be because the project is going to be somewhere way in the future and who knows with inflation uh and that it's the fact that we're a town of about 5,500 people with limited income I think that uh you the council need to be fiscally responsible and looking at the benefits to be gained and the losses to be avoided by moving forward with this program and also the skip program uh it's a lot to absorb a lot to understand and I wish you luck in your decisionmaking process thank you thank you Ron Bruce Arin thank you um uh great presentation tonight I just want to me it's so positive we have a uh I want to encourage the council to take this I know you guys are going to take it very seriously but to uh create the letter of intent or theou whatever it takes and this opportunity has presented ourself uh itself to us we need the water water is going to go through the roof we really don't have a great source of water that we can claim today this is a huge opportunity and as manager Grady Miller point pointed out we have a way out at the last minute if we wanted to let's find out everything and take it very seriously I think you guys will be heroes if we make this thing happen and the town will be secure uh with water so I encourage a yes I think in September when you're GNA vote on it thank you thank you m Darlin I do not have any additional speakers okay well I'd like to thank SRP and and uh I think we have a I'll get a comment from staff here but I think you've got the standing or uh process we have is you're going to present an analysis and a recommendation at the meeting uh coming up and we'll have uh our we'll be able to put our own situation over what we've heard tonight and see um and all we're voting for is to see another card kind of like a poker match yes Auntie yeah so I'll ask staff if they have any final comments staff uh coun excuse me I just have one uh time is of the essence I think we heard that SRP needs to make some decisions in September do we have an exact date in September that you need our response vice mayor um and Council uh kind of laying out the timeline we would need to know um probably by the middle of September um because once once we get the decision that you want to move forward we have to put that to a vote um to the steering committee um that is probably going to be a two-e process so that gets us to the end of September and then we would only have about a month to go through the water needs and the allocation process so um it's a pretty quick turnaround so I guess to answer your question probably by the middle of September we would need to know okay we'll get that done yeah um and I I think it's fits with our schedule right now um I'll talk to Kyle after the meeting but um we could do this letter of intent which you know if the council opted not to do theou which would finalize and uh formalize the relationship then that's all off and then that's it so um but we'll we'll we'll be able to stay with the schedule that we just heard from Jacob right because our first meeting in September it's not until the 16th right right yeah so we yeah might need to adjust that would we need an additional meeting what what you can't hear Hello I'm Amanda monise I'm a representative um of central Arizona project sit on the board and um just something to consider knowing what's going on with cap in the Colorado River and the needs of this this town um being that cap is 100% of your portfolio and looking at what our future looks like on the capap I would hope that the needs assessment on um the SRP Dam project would be fairly large in your favor um looking at other partners in this project um they have larger portfolios that have mixture of different types of water but the need of this town seems to be very great in needing an additional water supply and looking at what the state has to offer in additional Water Supplies currently at this time is extremely minimal so taking a gamble to see that any additional water can be added to the town is probably greatly um in consideration for you to say yes so I just want to make those those comments for your time thank you thank you Council any other any closing comments so I do have a question um are we going to have to have a special town meeting Town Council maybe I'm going to talk to Kyle if I need to I'll I'll work with the Council on trying to find an available date um as you know the Labor Day has caused a little bit of a problem with a regular regularly scheduled council meeting on the second but if we need to we will we do have a special meeting on the 9th so we could squeeze it in if we had integrated water master plan I have that on my cend yes um but it's a work session and it's probably a three-hour work session just on that so it's not to say it can't be done I'm just saying it it's I think we'll have to have this as a separate meeting date okay seeing no further business meetings Jour thank you all for attending and thank you SRP