Scottsdale Planning Commission defers Banner Health $750M hospital rezoning vote

Planning Commission public hearing. The city appreciates your interest and participation in the public hearing process. The planning commission serves as an advisory board to the city council on land use and zoning matters. The hearing agenda items consist of development applications that require public hearings. The planning commission considers the item and makes a recommendation for approval or denial to the city council.

The city council will make the final decision for or against approval of the application. The agenda consists of the roll call, administrative report by staff, public comment for non-aggendaized items, approval of minutes for the previous hearing, continuences for items that will not be heard tonight, withdrawals for items that have been withdrawn from any further consideration, consent agenda for items not likely to require a presentation or discussion.

All items on the consent agenda may be voted on together. Any commissioner may move any item from consent agenda to the regular agenda. regular agendas where each item includes a presentation and a recommendation by staff, a presentation by the applicant and public comments. The applicant will have an opportunity to respond to the public comments. The planning commission will deliberate on the case and cast their votes. Non-action items are for discussion only items.

No vote will be cast by the planning commission. Citizens wishing to speak on any agenda item will need to fill out either a blue speaker card or if not willing to speak may fill out a yellow comment card and turn it into staff table before the agenda item is to be discussed. The chair will call your name when it is your turn to speak. When called please come to the podium which is over there. Uh state your name and address and then begin speaking.

Groups wishing to speak should elect a spokesperson to represent the views of the group. To facilitate the meeting, your comment will be limited to three minutes for individual speakers, one additional minute for each additional individual who is present at the hearing and has contributed their time to a representative speaker up to a maximum of 10 minutes. Please format your speech to fit within the allotted time. A light system is installed on the podium for timing presentations.

The light will be green for two minutes, yellow for one, and red when your time is up. Please conclude your comments when the red light appears. Thank you for your interest. And now we'll begin the hearing with the roll call. Chair Scar Bro here. Vice Chair Young here. Commissioner Gonzalez present. Commissioner here. Commissioner Joiner here. Commissioner Drake here. Commissioner Reid here. All here. Thank you. Thank [clears throat] you.

Uh next on uh the agenda is public comment on non-aggendaized items. Do we have anything here? No, Mr. Chairman. Okay, great. Perfect. Then moving on to the administrative report. Mr. Curtis. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, members of planning commission. Welcome back uh for the new year. I just wanted to bring to your attention uh for items five and six tonight. um you've been inundated with public comment over the last week or so.

Um all of those were uh um added to a link that was included in the report uh that was part of the agenda. Um, and so that has been updated and kept up to date, but we did provide you with um some of the public comment that we received in the last probably 24 hours or so, just so you have those uh in hand in case you didn't get a chance to to check that link uh today or this afternoon. Uh and then the other item, Mr.

Chairman, members of the commission, we do plan on having a meeting uh in two weeks uh regular scheduled for January 28th. So, just want to let you know we are anticipating to have a meeting then. That's all I have for you tonight. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Curtis. Appreciate the information. Next, uh we have the minutes. Uh we have minutes from December 10th, 2025. If there are any comments for those minutes, and if not, I'll uh entertain a motion.

Chair Scarbor, I'll move for approval of the December 10th, 2025 regular meeting minutes as written. Thank you, Vice Chair. Uh we have a motion. Do we have a second? I'll second it. Perfect. Thank you, Commissioner. Uh, so with that, um, we have a first by Chair Young and a second by Commissioner Drake. Apologize about that. Took me a second. Apologize. Uh, so with that, let's do a roll call. Chair Scar Bro, yes. Vice Chair Young, yes. Commissioner Gonzalez, yes. Commissioner Ertell, yes.

Commissioner Joiner, yes. Commissioner Drake, yes. Commissioner Reid, yes. Motion passes. Thank you. Perfect. Next we have the consent agenda. I do have a request from commissioners to move three and four from the consent agenda to regular agenda. Uh with that said, uh does anybody want to move two or should we entertain a motion? Mr. Chairman. Yes. I'll make a motion to approve the consent agenda item two, planning commission annual report. We have a motion. Do I have a second?

I second the motion. Okay. Uh, if I could get a roll call vote. Chair Scar Bro, yes. Vice Chair Young, yes. Commissioner Gonzalez, yes. Commissioner Ertell, yes. Commissioner Joiner, yes. Commissioner Drake, yes. Commissioner Reid, yes. Motion passes. Thank you. Thank you. With that said, we'll move to the regular agenda and we'll start with item number three. 3TA 2024 number three, adaptive reuse text amendment. Good evening, chair, members of the commission.

Brad Carr with the planning department. Um, happy to answer any questions or just go through a brief summary of this at the choice of the commission. Uh, we have Commissioner Gonzalez. Would you just a just a short preview just to bring us up to speed on it? Absolutely. Thank you. So this uh particular item in front of you this evening is yet another text amendment related to the adaptive reuse legislation. This time house bill which was during the 2025 session.

Um this latest text amendment is a result of some additional feedback we received from the state legisl state legislature and I'll go through that here in a moment. So again, as uh as we always state with with regards to um the codes and regulations that we put in place, those things are as a result of local authority given by the state to cities and towns to to regulate zoning and land use regulations. House Bill 2110, as I mentioned, was passed in 2025.

It speaks to uh allowing adaptive reuse of parcels u with existing commercial, office or mixeduse buildings to be re redeveloped as multif family housing. The city must comply with the state law, which we're intending to do with this update. Um, and this what this update is doing is updating our methodology for determining which sites are eligible for adaptive reuse and multifamily conversion parcels.

Um, this zoning ordinance update is necessary to update some with some recent alignments the city council made to the city's commercial employment hubs and essential areas table which was adopted by council in early December last year. So, why is that update needed?

As I can show on the screen here, um this bill um outlines some specific requirements with regard to conversion of uh properties that are eligible, specifically with regards to the airport areas that were previously um excluded from the ability to do this particular legislation. Those areas were shown in the red on the screen here as they overlay the the overall map of Scottsdale.

um large area around the city of Scottsdale's Scottsdale airport as well as the area of the Sky Harbor Airport that extends the southern portion of Scottsdale. Those particular areas based on a prior interpretation of um how the airport exclusion applied. We're those all those properties in those areas would have been excluded under that prior interpretation because that new interpretation has been updated.

We're are fully replacing that approach with a new approach that now makes more properties eligible as a result. the area that is now excluded is shrinks dramatically to just that area shown in red around the Scottsdale airport. And of course now because that area shrinks, nothing in the southern part of the city is is disqualified as a result of the airport. That opens up, as I mentioned, many more parcels um that were potentially eligible for this conversion.

prior that would have been 404 U parcels that were um that were outside of the TPA areas um that would have been totally eligible as a commercial property. Now that's 4,71. Um the city does have the ability to protect 10% of those areas as an exclusion um through those aforementioned hubs that I talked about the council um revising on 121. That uh amounts to 407 parcels that are that have been protected.

Those are may be difficult to see on the screen in front of you, but those are shown in blue throughout the entire Scottsdale community. There's a heavy focus around Oldtown for the purpose of protecting um existing pattern of development and character of Oldtown. Um but there are scattering of different areas that the city has chosen to protect mostly those neighborhood servicing commercial areas like uh grocery stores and the such and that selection method is shown on the screen here.

Um, I won't go into great detail on that, but as you can see, there was 40 prior parcels that were protected. Those are included with the new methodology in addition to 23 that focus on those neighborhood centers, new areas within Oldtown. Uh, you can see there, that's the primary focus. And again, the total is 407 throughout the community that are now protected. That concludes um my uh my presentation this evening. Again, I'm happy to answer any questions you may have. Thank you, Mr. Carr.

Uh, Commissioner Gonzalez, do you have any questions? Um, not really. I just wanted to So, basically what we had to do is we had to uh come into compliance of what the state requirements were. Yes, Chair Scarro, Commissioner Gonzalez, you're correct. Yeah. Um, it was determined by the state legislature that our prior approach wasn't in compliance.

this uh update that we're making to the text with via text amendment to our city code will align with some recent updates the council did to bring everything back into compliance. Okay. And so did the at this at this point this has the state reviewed this and said that we're in compliance? They haven't reviewed this specific thing because it's not approved commissioner u but they have they've approved of our approach for this. Okay. Well thank you very much Mr. Carr for your uh review.

I appreciate that and I'm I wanted everybody just to be able to try and understand this. I'm I'm still trying to understand it, but in any case, thank you for your time. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Carr. Thank you, Commissioner Gonzalez. Do we have any other questions from commissioners on this item? If there are no other questions, I'll entertain a motion. I'll make a motion. Uh you're laughing.

Make a motion for recommendation of approval to city council for case 3A 2024 number three after finding that the text amendment is consistent with and conforms to the adopted general plan. Perfectly done. We have a motion. Do I hear a second? Do we have a second? I'll second it. Perfect. Thank you. We have a motion to second. Roll call vote, please. Chair Scarro. Yes. Vice Chair Young. Yes. Commissioner Gonzalez, yes. Commissioner Eertell, yes. Commissioner Joiner, under protest, yes.

Commissioner Drake, yes. Commissioner Reid, yes. Motion passes. Thank you. Perfect. And we'll move on to item number 49 up 2015, number four, CSI, CUP renewal 2026. Mr. Kluff. Yes. Uh, thank you and good evening, Mr. Chair and Planning Commission. Uh, Brian Kluff with the city's planning department. Um, I'll be giving you a brief overview of the request tonight related to 9UP 2015 number four.

Uh, specifically this evening, the request is uh from the property owner uh regarding an existing conditional use permit for a marijuana use at the subject site. Uh the request is to renew that existing uh conditional use permit and also to eliminate the five-year timing stipulation that was placed on that which is requiring them to come back every 5 years for renewal of the use permit. Uh the site we're looking at is in the air park area.

You can see it's just southeast of the airport uh on 78th Way. A closer look at the site here. You can see the existing building. It is a second level suite uh in that building where the existing uh dispensary is located. Uh here's an overhead view of the site. Uh in addition to the zoning uh it's zoned industrial park I1 district. Uh it's also surrounded by other properties zoned industrial park. Uh this is the site plan.

Um it's essentially the existing uh site improvements showing the existing building and parking. uh they are not proposing any changes uh to the site or the floor plan as part of the request. This is a look at the existing floor plan of the uh dispensary layout. As I mentioned, they're not requesting any modifications as part of this. Um in summary, again, the request is for renewal of the existing conditional use permit for a marijuana use.

Um, specifically to the five-year timing stipulation, the request is to have that removed so they don't have to come back every 5 years for renewal. Um, there are uh that timing step was something that uh was put into place in 2011 when uh the marijuana uses were new and recently approved by the legislature. we weren't sure uh what the uh impact of those uses were were and that was kind of a a safety net for them to come back just in case there were any issues.

Um over the last 15 years that they've been in operation, we've seen that they're comparable to other uh office and medical uses uh in the areas and there's not been any uh negative impacts that we've been made aware of. Um there are six total marijuana uses within the city. Um four of those have already had this timing stipulation rene uh removed. Um so if this one were to be approved, there would be just one location left that still has that 5-year timing stipulation on it.

Um that concludes staff's presentation. Um the applicant is also here if there's additional questions or if you would like a presentation from them. Thank you, Mr. Kluff. Uh Mr. Gonzalez, um I just had one question. When this when these relications or first applications come through, but the reapplication itself, does it go through a uh formal uh vetting process again or is it just an automatic uh renewal and uh nobody's uh reviewed the application as far as police or anything that nature?

Uh, Chair Scar Bro, Commissioner Gonzalez, if I understand your question correctly, uh, when they come through to renew the conditional use permit, it's essentially the full review of a, uh, a complete conditional use permit application. So, it has a full staff review, including the police department review of their uh, public safety plan.

So if we remove this that that time stipulation on these on these permits these applications does that that basically gives a full permission by the police department and they never review this again. Uh, Cher Scar Bro, Commissioner Gonzalez. Um, no, it it doesn't. Um, the conditional use permit and the site would still be under the same conditions of a normal use permit.

If there were any changes to the floor plan or operations, um, they would need to coordinate that with our police department and submit updated public safety plans. Uh, and those would be reviewed at that time. Okay. Very good. Thank you, sir. I that that concludes my my interview that the applicant does not need to make a formal statement or anything at this time. Thank you, Commissioner Gonzalez. Do we have any other questions? And as I read, it could be uh revoked at any time, the C.

Is that correct? Uh Cher Scar Bro, Commissioner Drake, there are provisions uh in our zoning ordinance for a revocation process. So if the conditional use permit were not in conformance with any of the ordinance requirements or stipulations, that process could be started by the city. Okay. Thank you so much. If there are no other questions, I will take a motion for this case. Anybody? Well, since I'm back on the horse and didn't fall off, go for it. I'd be happy to make a motion again.

Make a motion for recommendation of approval to city council for case 9 UP 20115 number four after finding that the CUP criteria have been met and that the proposed conditional use permit is consistent and conforms with the adopted general plan per the attached stipulations. Thank you. We have a motion. Do we have a second? I'll second. Okay, we have a motion and a second. Roll call vote, please. Chair Scarro, yes. Vice Chair Young, yes. Commissioner Gonzalez, no. Commissioner, yes.

Commissioner Joiner, yes. Commissioner Drake, yes. Commissioner Reid, yes. Motion passes. Thank you. Thank you. Okay, moving on to item number five, 5ZN 2023, Banner Health, Scottsdale Medical Campus. Mr. Bloomberg. Uh thank you uh Chair Scarboro and planning commissioners. I'm actually going to do a presentation for both items five and six. Um and then you can do a motion accordingly.

Uh again, Greg Bloomberg with current planning here to give you an overview presentation of these of these two requests to be followed by uh a presentation by the applicant. The site is located uh above the loop 101 to the north uh to the west if my mouse is working.

This is the ASM corporate headquarters and research and development facility that's being constructed as we speak and to the east is a medical office building that is part of the is phase one basically of the banner campus that is also under construction. And then on the other side of the freeway is the Cavisson 130 acre Cavisson development. So the current zoning on the site is there's actually two zoning districts on the site right now.

There is uh C2 which is central business district plan community development. That's what PCD stands for. And then there's I1 PCD on a on a sliver towards the Miller Road alignment over here. That is industrial park uh plan community development. If this request is approved, the zoning will become plan community development commercial office. Presently the 2035 general plan designates the site as mixeduse neighborhoods. That's not changing.

And uh the greater air park character area plan designates the site as air park mixeduse residential. So some uh summary and some background for you. Uh in addition to the zoning request, uh a conditional use permit is also required for a hospital in the commercial office zoning district. [snorts] And as I mentioned, the first phase is under construction, the medical office building.

Uh the location of the hospital was actually shifted about 580 ft to the west in response to public input and I'll show that to you in some graphics here momentarily. Uh the applicant did conduct a market analysis which indicated a gap in service for this region. Um there are water and sewer infrastructure upgrades that are presently uh underway. The master developer is constructing those. Uh proposed building height is 74 feet exclusive of rooftop impertinances.

Uh the ordinance allows 75 exclusive and inclusive of rooftop appertinances is 94 ft. Uh the applicant is not requesting any bonus or amended development standards. Uh and uh significant public comment has been received in support and in opposition. uh at last count we are up around a thousand emails and letters. So this is the original site plan from 2023 and I just wanted to add this to my presentation so you could see the layout.

The hospital was originally uh sort of centrally located on the site closer to the east end and the medical office building was up at the northwest corner of the site near Miller Road. And then as I mentioned this is the current site plan. So the hospitals shifted from, you know, right about here over to here. And the medical office moved from here, oops, down to here. So I just wanted you to see that for context purposes. [snorts] Um, landscape and open space, uh, there'll be quite a bit of it.

Most of it will be along the Mayo Boulevard frontage. Uh, in addition to that, uh, there's quite a bit of pedestrian connectivity throughout the site.

Uh the one thing that we wanted to point out was a 10-ft multi-use path uh along the entire frontage along Mayo Boulevard that eventually is going to connect with the ASM sites uh uh pedestrian improvements, the Optima pedestrian improvements, and eventually we should have uh a very uh positive experience pedestrian wise all the way from Scottsdale to Hayden. So that's that's kind of planned and so they've been responsive to that particular request.

Uh these are the building elevations conceptual at this point. Um again 74 feet to the top of the roof 94 inclusive of rooftop impertinances. So this uh application did go before the airport advisory commission back on September 17th of 2025. Uh the commission recommended denial to the city council by a vote of 5 to one. Uh the reason being concerns about noise from low-flying helicopters uh helicopters basically flying at low altitude.

Uh but I should point out that the the Federal Aviation Administration has issued uh a determination of no hazard for the hospital. uh that was received in 2023 [snorts] and a similar determination for the helellipad was also received by staff after the AAC hearing. That concludes staff's presentation. Happy to answer any questions if you have anything for me immediately. Otherwise, I'll turn it over to the applicant. Thank you, Mr. Bloomberg.

Do we have any questions from the commissioners for staff? Commissioner Gonzalez, go ahead. Um, do you know by any chance, Mr. Bloomberg, that how many helipad uh or participants of helicopters we have in the Scottsdale Air Park? Uh, Cher Scarro and Commissioner Gonzalez, I do not. Okay. Um, do you even even have a Do you have any figure at all idea like it's five or six or anything? I think we've had at least four applications in the last three years. Commissioner Gonzalez. Yeah.

I mean, it's it's not a common I can just say it's not a common land use even in the air park area, but there are a few. Yes. Very good. Thank you, sir. Anybody else have comments at this point or questions? Okay. We'll hear from the applicant. Good evening, chair, vice chair, commissioners. My name is Susan Demit with Gamage in Burnham. Uh just for your records, 40 North Central Avenue in Phoenix.

Um I'm here tonight on behalf of Hanner Banner Health to talk about the Banner Scottsdale Medical Campus. Uh before I make my remarks regarding the land use request and the conditional use per pit, I would like to introduce Amy Perry, who's the president and CEO of Banner Health, and she'd like to kick us off with a few remarks about Banner's interest in Scottsdale. Thank you so much. Thank you, Chair Scarro and commissioners. Thank you for the opportunity um for us to be here.

So, Banner Health, what does that mean to you? What does it mean to Scottsdale? What does it mean to the state of Arizona? To me, banner means care, love, investment, health, impact, research, cures that save lives, treatments that change lives, innovation, technology, education, jobs, health insurance, construction projects, care for the state's most vulnerable. and truly making a difference in Arizona by being here for everyone. Banner has served Scottsdale for more than 40 years.

We are committed to a healthy and thriving community. More than 75,000 Scottsdale residents have chosen Banner for their care in the past three years alone. That trust matters to us. It's why we have been thoughtfully working with city leadership and the community to create a campus that fits everyone's needs and rounds out Banner's existing network of care in Scottsdale. Banner's mission is to make health care easier so life can be better.

Scottsdale residents deserve that level of commitment and they deserve a choice for their health care needs. This new campus is also a major economic commitment. It represents $750 million in private investment. It will expand access to advanced hospital services in Scottsdale. And as Scottsdale continues to grow, we are investing in critical public water, sewer, and roadway improvements for the city.

A new Banner Health Plus is already under construction, and tonight we are coming here for the approval of phase 2, our hospital. [snorts] What I want you to remember, please, is that Banner is a nonprofit organization. All of our margin is reinvested into the communities we serve. Helping our neighbors, helping our patients and our members. It is not channeled to Wall Street and not a dime leaves the community. Banner provides more than $1 billion dollar in community and free services annually.

That means free food for seniors. That means a school for the autistic. That means things that you don't see every day that we're doing to make the lives better for the people who live in this community and beyond. You may hear talk that this will have an emergency room impact. But I want to tell you being the owner of 33 hospitals that additional health care, additional hospitals, additional emergency rooms, they provide capacity and capacity improves access.

Banner partners with emergency systems across Arizona every day and we have never opposed another health system building in our areas. As Arizona's largest employer, Banner is also driving the solution on health care workforce challenges. We are proud of our partnerships with university and community colleges across the state. And it's incredibly important that you hear this. Banner trains more than 1300 residents and fellows. We provide the most physicians, new clinicians in this state.

So when you hear about potential workforce shortages, Banner works full-time to fill those needs. We train 7,000 nursing rotations annually. We are providing the workforce for the state and we care about making sure that there's enough clinicians and enough access for all of us, not just for Banner, but for all health systems.

This campus will provide many new care options, including MD Anderson Cancer Center, a nationally renowned cardiovascular service line, clinical trials, and new technologies. Commissioners, this is a thoughtful, collaborative plan that meets Scottsdale's future health care needs. It's right for the region, it's right for the city, and it's in the right location. Banner Health respectfully requests your support. Thank you. Thank you, Amy, for setting the stage.

Um, I intend to focus my remarks tonight um largely on the land use decision that's in front of you. Greg Bloomberg um who we've worked very closely with over the last few years has set the stage for you um walking you through our request and the development plan. I don't have any slides that I'm going to share with my presentation. Um but I do want to um start with I think what I feel is important foundational point which is what we're asking for today.

The commercial office land use that we are requesting um that Greg walked you through for the site is actually already allowed under the Crossroads East PCD. When the Scottsdale City Council approved Crossroads East, which is the zoning that governs this site, commercial office was included as an allowed use on this specific property in the land use budget in that PCD.

We are in effect with our request trading in higher intensity C2 and I1 land uses in exchange for this C commercial office designation. And in June of 2024, the Arizona State Land Department, who controls the Crossroads East PCD largely in partnership with the city and who used to own this property, uh provided a written authorization letter to Banner uh uh signing off approving of this reallocation uh of commercial office from the land use bank to this site.

An important complement to this point about the CO zoning. Banner's development plan intentionally works within the four corners of the Crossroads East PCD. We're not requesting any amended development standards. We're not requesting to deviate from zoning standards. We are working within the height and intensity and we meet all required standards for setbacks, parking, and open space. In fact, we considerably exceed many of those minimum requirements.

So, from a pure land use standpoint, this is not a request to change the rules. It's a request to apply the rules as written. The crux of this application really falls to the conditional use permit component of the request within the commercial office district. A hospital is allowed if a companion conditional use permit is approved. That is the second application we have filed.

The conditional use permit criteria um which were discussed at length in the staff report but I'm going to summarize some of them here include the following. The first is the use will not materially be detrimental to the public health safety and welfare that is largely geared towards noise, vibration, smoke, odor, gases and things like that as they're called out. In this instance, this campus has been designed to situate the hospital as far west as possible on the site.

Uh that was in response to feedback from the community. Uh the site is immediately adjacent to the industrially zoned ASM campus and adjacent to the loop 101 freeway. The hospital effectively is a buffer and a transitional use to lesser intense and varying land uses to our south. The proposed development, this is the second criteria, will not have an unusual volume of traffic.

The traffic generated by the hospital and we have an approved uh traffic impact and mitigation analysis falls well within the characteristics of traffic that could result from other land uses that are already allowed by right on this site. Access to the site is actually quite robust with traffic able to disperse along Mayo Boulevard to Scottsdale Road to Hayden Road to the 101 and eventually on Miller Road when the underpass uh is activated under the 101.

Banner has noted that the site access for this facility will be among the best of any of their facilities in the valley. The third use permit criteria is that the development is reasonably compatible with surrounding development. The hospital is pro proposed again adjacent to the loop 101, Hayden Road, Mayo Boulevard or major arterial roadways.

The hospital is complimentary to the land use patterns that are already evolving in the area which include a strong mix of office, highintensity multifamily, industrial and retail. Hospitals are regional land uses and freeway adjacent sites are generally where cities plan for them. Compared to what could otherwise be built here under the existing zoning, the hospital and the campus proposed by Banner provides predictability, compatibility, and long-term certainty for this site.

Your zoning ordinance also includes additional use permit criteria for the hospital. The first is that the hospital will meet all state and county regulations. As with all of its facilities, Banner easily makes that commitment. The facility cannot exceed 75 ft in height. We meet this standard. The ordinance includes defined and enhanced open space standards for hospitals. We meet these standards as well.

Uh and in fact with 546,000 square feet of open space and 106,000 square feet of frontage open space, we're providing almost double the required open space on this site. The ordinance also includes heightened setback standards when the property is adjacent to residential development. In this instance here, we have an almost 700 foot setback from the nearest residential which is multif family to our southeast.

So when you look objectively at these defined criteria and measured against the city's own standards, staff has concluded and we agree that this project meets the criteria for conditional use permit approval. Um from there I want to talk for a second about infrastructure. Um Amy touched on this. Another critical land use consideration is infrastructure and Banner is doing its part in more with this campus.

Banner has committed to provide nearly $17 million in funding and construction towards public infrastructure on and off this site. Banner in partnership with the master developer of the planning unit within the Crossroads East PCD is ensuring that the surrounding roadway network meets the needs of not only Banners Plan campus but the city's long-term master plans. Uh just a quick listing of some of those improvements include that Mayo Boulevard will be completed from Hayden to Scottsdale Road.

There are improvements being constructed on the Loop 101 offramp at Hayden Road. A continuous Hayden Road right turn lane will be constructed between Mayo Boulevard and the Loop 101. There's a traffic signal going in at Hayden uh and Mayo. I understand that the signal equipment has already been ordered. Um and then Miller Road will be constructed adjacent to our site in partnership with ASM and that ultimately provides another connection under the under the freeway for North Scottsdale.

With these improvements in place, the hospital again will have considerable and diverse access. On the water and sewer front, water and sewer infrastructure is being extended and expanded and it will not only serve again this project, but the broader Crossroads East area. Banner is a funding partner in the regional water infrastructure that is necessary for the area's long-term growth.

All of these infrastructure investments benefit the city well beyond this campus and importantly will be completed before the hospital is open. Greg also touched on the helellipad in his presentation. I do want to spend a few minutes providing some details regarding the helellipad. As many of you probably know by now, we've had a lot of conversations. A helellipad is a standard component of any acute care hospital. Selectively used for time-sensitive lifethreatening patient transport.

The helipad for this banner Scottsdale Medical Center will be excuse exclusively used to transport patients away from the hospital to the next closest facility when a patient needs a higher level of care. And when I say they will transport to the next facility, that could be another Banner facility. It could be an Honor Health facility. It could be a Mayo facility. Dignity or beyond. Um patients are transported to the closest facility that can provide the care that they need.

Based on as far as use of the helellipad and the um intensity of use at a facility like this, based on data from Banner's comparable hospitals with operational helellipads, we expect approximately one outbound flight per week on average. Um and although this information was included in your staff report, we had provided some supplemental information regarding the helellipad about changes have been made uh since the airport advisory commission last September.

I do want to run through a few of those with you. The first point is that there will only be one operational uh helellipad proposed for the campus. Two are shown on the site plan. The one is a groundmounted helellipad that will be uh activated with phase one of the hospital. Eventually when the phase three patient tower is constructed uh and there's not a timeline for that. Uh the the helellipad will be moved to the top of that patient tower the ground mounted helellipad will be decommissioned.

Uh we have proposed a modification to one of the staff stipulations to clarify this point. The second point is that we have reduced the number of potential flight paths for the helicopter traffic uh to access the hospital. We originally had proposed three and we have limited that now to two based on feedback from the airport advisory commission. There was an original southeastern flight path that had the potential to more conflict with airport uh Scottsdale airport traffic.

Um, we now have eliminated that choice and the approved flight paths per the FAA, which I'll talk about in a minute, are to the north and the southwest away from the Scottsdale airport. Just a quick point regarding safety and helicopter safety. Banner and its medical transport partners are exceptionally experienced.

Where the FAA requires 500 hours of total flight time for medical flight pilots, ours require a minimum of 2,000 hours with the average experience of a Banner pilot being 4,500 hours of flight time. In short, Banner ensures that its most critical patients are being entrusted to the best and most experienced pilots.

The fourth point regarding the helellipad, the FAA has now provided uh its 7480 determination of no conflict which is a specific approval by the FAA for the helellipad that provides confirmation that the helellipad can operate safely within the Scottsdale airport airspace. This is a key approval that speaks directly to the safety and operational expectations of the helellipad.

We received that on November 7th of last year, which was unfortunately two months after the airport advisory commission meeting. You can thank the government shutdown for that. Um, this new and additional information has been provided to city staff to the airport director uh and directly to the chair and the vice chair of the airport advisory commission.

I will say if there are further questions tonight about the helellipad, we do have Richard Swedberg here who's the chief operating officer of Banner Air and he is happy to answer those more detailed questions. I want to spend just a couple minutes talking about phasing of the hospital facility. I have How much more time do you think you need? I probably five more minutes. Okay, five minutes. Yeah.

Um, so as to phasing, we are asking for approval tonight of the full medical campus, but this facility will be constructed in phases. Phase one is the core hospital and 106 patient beds. Um, Banner anticipates that this first phase will meet Scottsdale's needs for the foreseeable future. Long-term buildout will grow the campus to approximately 300 beds.

The point here is simply that the campus has been designed to meet the needs of the market today and for the foreseeable future with an eye towards growing thoughtfully with the city of Scottsdale. I'm going to spend just another minute um on a sort of land use I'll call adjacent topic because we have been asked this many times through the course of this process. Why is Banner building a hospital here? Um, need is not a criterion for zoning, but context does matter.

Banner Health, and Amy mentioned this, builds patient care networks around systems of care. Tens of thousands of Scottsdale residents already seek care at Banner facilities in Scottsdale and across the valley every year. To that end, Banner has been serving Scottsdale for 40 years. The first phase of this campus, the Health Center Plus, is under construction. The hospital is the last piece of the puzzle for Banner to fully serve the Scottsdale market.

In addition to the existing Banner physicians that are already in Scottsdale, the health center plus will house 40 to 60 physicians and specialists, many of whom will practice at this hospital when their patients need a higher level of care. Based on our patient data, Banner expects that the existing Scottsdale area patients alone will fill nearly half the beds planned for this hospital in the first phase on day one. Uh Greg Bloomberg, city staff touched a little bit on community support.

I just have um two more items to address. Um, but as a result of very intentional education uh and outreach efforts, Banner has collected more than a thousand letters and emails in support to date. Those residents live throughout the city of Scottsdale. They've all willingly attached their name, address, and contact information to a letter support that's in the packet. These are the residents that Banner will serve.

Uh, one technical item that I want to address up front and we can discuss this a little bit more as the hearing moves forward with respect to the stipulations proposed by city staff. Banner is in agreement with those stipulations with two proposed modifications. These changes have been discussed with staff and we would ask that they're included uh and we do have copies of these we can pass out um included in a motion to support this project if the commission is so inclined.

The first is stipulation two of the use permit case. We're proposing to add language to that stipulation to provide assurances that there will only ever be one operational helellipad. The second will be changes to stipulation 7 of the use permit case and this is more of a technical change. This this stipulation is written to address an FAA form 5010 that is provided to the FAA and ultimately to the city once the helellipad is constructed.

The stipulation was originally written that this would be provided to the city staff within 30 days of our conditional use permit approval. We've asked that to be changed to completion of construction to align with the FAA's requirements. So, I'm going to close with this. I can only speak for myself, but I suspect that over the course of this process, you've all learned far more about healthc care policy operations than you ever thought you needed to know.

And I appreciate and the entire Banner team, mind you, appreciates the diligence and care each of you has brought to understanding this project. Ultimately, the decision before you tonight is not about policy, operations, or need. This is a land use decision. Based on Banner's experience is the largest hospital operator in the state of Arizona. We strongly believe the answer is yes.

Banner has come forward with a project that fix the scale and the scope of the surrounding area, complies with the zoning ordinance in the Crossroads East PCD, and invests in Scottsdale's infrastructure for the long term. The project will provide options for residents to get more of the care they already need without leaving Scottsdale. Banner, as noted, is making a significant private investment. They're creating a significant thousands of highquality jobs.

This all strengthens the city's long-term quality of life and tax base. Banner is excited and committed to make this investment in Scottsdale and to round out its healthc care network to serve Scottsdale. And with that, I will conclude and happy to answer any questions you might have at this point. Thank you, Mr. Derbit. Uh, I will turn to commissioners and see if we have questions. Okay, Commissioner Joiner. Hi there. Hello. Excellent presentation. I have two questions um to start with.

Uh, and it could be something I missed in the 600page application we received. Um, one has to do with the light at Mayo and Hayden. You just mentioned that it was going in. The packet that I read said it was going in in 2040. So, thank you for that, Chairman Scarro.

Um, Commissioner Joiner, we actually had a so the master developer, which is a group led by Dorito Partners in the Vantile Group, um, who originally had purchased the banner property and the ASM property are spearheading, uh, the infrastructure improvements that will serve this site. That includes water, sewer, and roads.

Uh I had a exchange with their engineer at Kimley Horn yesterday and that uh signal is being designed and will be constructed now with the improvements that we're putting in on Hayden and uh Mayo Boulevard. The signal equipment has actually already been ordered um from what what I was told yesterday. So it's going in it will be in before this hospital opens. So, you're saying that that will be a condition of your certificate of occupancy then? Is that correct? I I think that's fair. Yes.

I mean, it will be in long before we start construction on this hospital, which is a three-year build. Uh, you know, so that's that's very fair to say. Troy is nodding at me. Everybody nodding their head on the front row. Yeah. Uh, my second question has to do with something you just mentioned about the construction of the helellipad once it moves off the ground. And when I was reading the packet again, maybe I missed something. It looks to me like that that's going on building two phase three.

Is that correct? Patient tower two, which is part of phase three. Correct. And so, but there was no place that the height of that fivestory phase three building was going to be. So, what will be the height of that building? Sure. And your infrastructure and then the helicopter. the height of that building. Again, we're working within the requirement of the cup, which would allow up to 75 feet. Our patient tower, the So, the first patient tower that's being built with phase one is four stories.

Four stories, probably 65ish feet. The phase three patient tower, which is the second one, is a fivetory structure that will be 74 feet in height. The helellipad is on the roof of that building. All with it. It's it will all be within the height limit. So by the time you get to city council, those two numbers will be changed from the application. Is that correct? Right now, building one is showing 75 ft and no footage is showed on the uh fivestory building.

We I will take a look at that, but that is a yes, that is a commitment we can make because that is the design. Those are the those are the plans. That's the intent. Okay, that's all for now. Thank you. Thank you, chairman. Thank you, Commissioner Joiner. Anybody else? Commissioner Gonzalez. Um, let me ask you a question. Is, you know, over this time period I've been looking at this project. I've been told that the the business model for medical is different.

That no longer are big hospitals necessary. that all everybody's doing surgery centers and you know many medical complexes and everything. Why is Banner decided to do uh something like this? Troy, who do you want to answer that question? I'm I'm going to have one of the Banner executives answer that question for you if you don't mind, Commissioner Gonzalez. Thank you, Amy. It's a really good question. I think in a perfect world, we won't need any more hospitals.

You know, I think that at the end of the day, um, and especially Banner, we're committed to health insurance, health outcomes, prevention, keeping people out of the hospital. But the truth is, we just can't avoid chronic disease, aging, the kinds of things that people need tertiary care for. And, you know, we're there for complex surgeries. There are a lot of things that just you can't go home right after. And so, we want to have the beds to support that.

So, um I would say you're right that the hope is that we continue to make strides in chronic disease management and prevention, but ultimately we're living in a world where we still have a lot of health needs. And so we find it's necessary and in most of our hospitals are really operating at their very at their capacity and we're ending up expanding right now many of our current sites because of just extraordinary need. Okay.

So basically let me ask you a question that follow up on that then what you're saying is your business model says that that we need these hospitals we need these beds. We don't need tertiary uh office space and everything doing surges centers and other short-term type of uh projects as far as as a business model. So, Chair Scarboro and Commissioner Gonzalez, we need both. We live in a very in a growth community um with lots of health needs. We have a very large ambulatory network.

We have, as you know, we have a big sports medicine um campus already in Scottsdale. We have primary care again to keep people well on Raintree and and in North Scottsdale. So, we're working on this ambulatory network. We have um on uh 44th and Camelback, we have an ambulatory surgery center. So, we would like to be able to provide a lot of these services on an ambulatory basis. It's just not possible, especially if you have a chronic condition.

If you have an, you know, an aging parent, they might not do as well in an outpatient environment. So, we take patient safety first and some of our patients require that extra care. Well, thank you very much for that. Thank you. Perfect. Do we have any other questions? Go ahead, Commissioner. Thank you, Chair. Um you talked about needing more hospital or the the country the city needs more hospitals.

um I got into looking at um the additional number of beds and I thought what's the ideal number and so I went to Grock and I'm not sure that that was you know I'm not sure it's accurate but they came up with in Japan there are something like 1,200 beds per 100,000 people and in developed countries the average is something like 400 and we're a bit below that here in uh well in certainly in the United States.

I think United States was 280 um overall, but you know, Scottsdale, Scottsdale should have more, should have taken care of us old people. We need the hospitals. Um anyway, so it was, you know, earlier you said or somebody said, you know, we've learned more about operations than, you know, we wanted to. I've not learned enough. Um, I don't know what the right number of beds is, but that's not a decision that government should be making.

I don't believe that's something that, you know, free market should be making. However, um, I look at the 300 beds and again, from what I learned on the internet, um, that doesn't come up with 2500 uh, new jobs that was listed in the in the write up. And I'm guessing that I'm overlooking something research or whatever. How is it? How do you get the 2500 new jobs? Thank you.

And again, Chair Scarro, Commissioner Earl, I'm going to have Troy Freeman, vice president of real estate for Banner Health, answer that question for you. Yeah, Chair Scarboro and and Commissioner, great question. We uh couple of things. We have fully studied the operations and forecast for this facility based upon 33 other hospitals that Banner operates. The the staffing model here requires physicians and nurses from a clinical perspective.

It creates uh a significant demand as well for administrative staff, support staff, everything down to cooks, EDS, you name it. Um so these are real numbers from Banner facilities that we operate a pretty robust network of and and we have a high level of confidence in. Yeah, I'm sure you do. Um, again, from what I saw, um, maximum of six employees, that includes the cooks and the janitors, uh, six employees per bed. So, that doesn't get you to 2500.

Is there another aspect of the hospital that uh would have employment other than related to beds or admin? And and just to clarify, yes, the 2500 is the full campus. So if you look at the hospital itself plus the outpatient building, the health center plus already under construction, it's a plus b to get to that 2500 full jobs there. Okay. Thank you. Yeah, you're welcome. Thank you, Commissioner. Any other questions? Looks like questions are being held for after public comments.

So let's get right to it. Uh we do have a quite a number of people who would like to speak for uh and against this project. Uh, so I'd like to just remind everybody that if somebody is speaking before you and they say exactly what you're thinking, it's absolutely fine to come up here and say exactly what they said or you could just say I agree with them and move on. Uh, so definitely don't want to limit anybody, but if you feel the desire to say I agree, that that's perfectly okay.

Uh, so with that said, we'll start with uh first person uh Doug Jordan. Uh, looks like he has seven donated minutes for a total of 10 minutes. So, if we can get that on the clock. And then after Mr. Jordan, we have Rick Murdoch. And then after Rick Murdoch, we have David Leawitz. Looks like he'd like to speak or donate his time to David Rizzik. So, I guess we'll figure that out in just a minute. So, Mr. Jordan, thank you, Chairman, Commission. Uh, my name is Doug Jordan.

It's been a long time since I've been at this podium. So, let me just give you a little background of of my uh career as a lawyer. I started practicing law in 1976. Uh from 1978 through 1982, I was town attorney for the town of Paradise Valley. I've been in private practice since then. Uh during that period of time I've been involved with uh the Rocky Mountain Land Use Institute based out of the University of Denver.

Uh they hold an annual conference on land use law and I was on the advisory board for the Rocky Mountain Land Use Institute. Uh for the last 30 something years I have been co-author of a book published by the State Bar of Arizona entitled Arizona Land Use Law. Um, I'm currently, well, in the last couple of years, I'd say I've represented two counties in Arizona in helping with the rewrite of their zoning ordinance.

I currently serve as a hearing officer for Maricopa County Planning and Development. So, I just wanted you to understand that this is an area that I understand. U, I have some of the oldfashioned Elmo slides here. So, let's see if I got this right. No. So, there's two things that I'm going to talk about. One is the notion of is this submittal in compliance with the general plan? The second is is it in compliance with the conditional use permit criteria? And my answer to both is no.

And that's what we're going to talk about today. Uh the language of the ordinance says substantial harmony. When I looked that up in the dictionary, substantial, fundamental, essential, harmony, conformity. So I think one thing that's important here and this becomes particularly important in the context of the uh Scottsdale airport that we are going to get to.

This is um healthy community element uh 1.1 in the general plan and it clearly says that the the the city should support the building of hospitals in underserved areas and I don't believe that this is an underserved area as we'll get to in a minute particularly given the uh proximity to the Scottsdale airport. So, why is it not an underserved area and there's a map that just kind of shows uh you know where the proposed banner site is and and by the way I'm representing Honor Health.

I I should have said that right at the beginning so my apologies. U the Honor Health Thompson Peak facility is shown there. Mayo Clinic is shown there and the proposed banner site. So I don't think that this meets an underserved area and I just read an article in the last week or so about a big proposed expansion at the Mayo Clinic. They were adding a lot and even the um Thompson Peak Honor Health Facility, they have another 64 beds.

They have 120 now and they can essentially add another 50% to that. So I think those are the things that we are we need to focus on. So both the city and the private sector uh you know have this role in balancing this critical land uses and hospitals certainly are a critical land use but this is not an underserved area. Uh and as I mentioned earlier, both Mayo Clinic has no restrictions on the number of beds it can have.

Honor Health uh SHA has no restrictions on the number of beds it can have and Honor Health Thompson Peak could add another 50% to their number of beds over what is built right now. So we believe that this request is not in substantial harmony harmony with the general plan. Probably the more important issue is this notion of airspace safety. So there's three separate sections from the general plan. Um, land use. Number three, a balance of land use.

Number LU7, protect the viability of the Scottsdale airport by encouraging compatible uses, land uses nearby. And then safety goal number five, maintain safe airspace. And I don't think that as you'll see later on that we are able to get to that point with this submitt. Now this is directly out of the U submitt that um was made in December about the airport safety and it refers to this. There's different types of flights.

This is a part 135 flight and it's different part types of flights and they refer to their slide 17. So the next one coming up is slide 17 and this is out of this the information that they submitted to the city. And what does it show? Fatalities. See the re the red arrow in the upper leftand corner the number of fatalities. And then the red arrow in the lower right hand side of that says, well, they're better than the others, but are they zero? No. So, what would happen with this?

It's not a matter of if, it's a matter of when. Uh as noted earlier, Banner did remove one of its flight paths from the uh uh after the airport advisory commission. Uh I've simply overlaid those flight paths. The green is what Banner had shown. The red circle is where they removed the one. But look at the flight paths there. Even if it's one a week, is that a chance that the city wants to endorse. There's another one.

These were all for three separate days and these were uh graphics that were used at the airport advisory commission. Again, I have added the green overlay to that. And here is the last one. And am I just blowing smoke? Well, I don't think so. Two incidents in 2025. This is one in December of 2025. Army helicopter and American Airlines jet. You probably all read about that in the news just a month ago. A horrendous accident. Do accidents happen? Yes.

Same same a graphic from the same incident back in December of 2025. Another one from November of 2025. Close call between the Southwest plane and a medical helicopter. Was there an accident? No. But it was close and we can't afford to do that. So in summary on the general plan issues, this is not a suitable location given the proximity of the airport.

is creating unnecessary additional risk for what is not an underserved area and I think that's critical to this discussion and again we don't want to sign off on creating that risk and the potential of fatalities as you know the airport advisory commission recommended denial why does not maintain safe airspace does not protect airport users does not protect surrounding neighborhoods the nearby properties and it is not in substantial harmony with the general plan.

Nor does it meet the required ordinance findings to meet to amend the plan community district which is what you have in front of you today. I'll try and hurry here. Conditional use permits similar issue here. These are the criteria some of the criteria for a conditional use permit. The granting of the CUP will not be materially detrimental to the public health, safety or welfare. And it in says several factors.

This one doesn't directly relate to the airport, but impact on surrounding areas resulting from an unusual volume of character traffic. In Banner's application, they were saying that there's no access ways or streets leading into the surrounding residential areas, but in fact, there are, and I think they said that both 78 Street, which is existing, Mr. Jordan, if you could wrap up your thoughts, please. I'll be very quick.

Um so again on the cup criteria the reasonable compatibility uh issue and I won't repeat these three slides of the um the airport flight paths four slides excuse me but let me just wrap it up with this this final comment there. So again, we're creating unnecessary additional risk which is in what is not an underserved area. We're not protecting the airport users and airspace. It's not a suitable location and we've talked about the traffic into the neighborhood. So with that, I will wrap it up.

Thank you very much. Thank you, Mr. Jordan. Next, we have Mr. Mr. Murdoch and then uh Mr. Lewitz uh did you want to donate your time to Mr. Rizzik? I'm sorry. Yes. Okay. Thank you. So after Mr. Leowitz would be um Anov Manucci. I hope I did not destroy that name. I'm so sorry if I did. Mr. Murdoch. Thank [clears throat] you, Chairman Scarbo and commissions. Commissioners, thank you for the opportunity to speak this evening. My name is Rick Murdoch. I'm a strategist at Honor Health.

I've been uh working with health care systems uh like Honor Health and others creating responsible development strategies for our communities. The first thing I want to call your attention to that I've snipped here is uh the city of Scottsdale's general plan for 2035, which is our city's guiding document for evaluating our resoning request.

The general plan, the very first healthy community policy goal states that the city should support critical health care facilities, particularly in underserved areas, and that healthc care facilities should be planned at the most suitable size, location, and type. Scottdale has excess hospital cap capacity today, and we will in the future as well. Looking at the data in the table that's provided here, this is probably the simplest and cleanest way to look at a bed supply by city zip codes.

This data is provided by the Arizona Department of Health Services. The national average is 2.32 hospital beds per thousand. The Arizona average is 1.9. Scottsdale currently sits at 3.6. This is dramatically higher than both the benchmarks. Anything above this is waste. waste that the other consumers will have to pay for when they're in the hospital.

This data clearly shows that Scottsdale is not underserved for inpatient hospital care and therefore does not meet our policy or our goal in the city's healthy community. Hospitals are among an infrastructure that are very intensive land use. They use heavy water, power consumption, and significant traffic and neighborhood congestion, high demands on public safety and emergency services.

The general plan directs the city to prioritize infrastructure use for facilities that fill an unmet community need. If Scottsdale residents are going to be asked to absorb traffic, resource use, land consumption, it should be for a clearly unmet need, which the applicant has tried to tell us implied through by stating that 75,000 Scottsdale residents left the city over over the last three years to receive care at a banner facility elsewhere.

This statement used in a resoning context is very misleading. The vast majority of these encounters are exactly as Commissioner Gonzalez called out. They are in outpatient settings. This applicant is already addressing the outpatient setting by the 120,000 square foot building that is currently under development. For hospital visits, we can go back to the state data again from the Arizona Department of Health Services.

It's going to show over the last three years that actual discharges from a Banner hospital for a Scottsdale resident is between 1,200 and,400. That's under a thousand unique Scottsdale residents that seek care at a Banner hospital in the last three years. Make matters even more, 50% of those patients entered a Banner facility through the emergency department. That leaves less than one patient a day that actually left the city seeking care from a banner facility.

Those people did not leave that had services for emergency. They didn't get to choose. They went to the nearest ED room where they could get care. Mr. If you could wrap up your thoughts. We'll do. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. This again fails to demonstrate that there's an unmet hospital need in Scottsdale. Finally, Scottsdale is one of the most fortunate cities in the entire country. We are filled we're we were very fortunate to be filled with A-rated quality safety hospital.

This report here that I'm displaying is from a premier national evaluator called Leaprog on hospital safety. Five of the nine A-rated hospitals that fill this valley. Five of those are provided by Honor Health. Three of them are in Scottsdale by Honor Health. One of them also serves North Scottsdale which is Mayo. for these reasons under the general plan. Mr.

Murdoch, if you could please do we believe that this resoning request is not in the best interest for the city, for the residents, and is not consistent with the general plan. Thank you, Commissioner. Thank you. I'm going to try one more time. Hopefully I do a better job. Uh Ann Maruchi. God, I hope I did better out time. Uh following her would be uh Bob Riley and then Helen Roga. Chairman Scarboro, Commissioners, good evening. My name is Anne Maruchi.

I've lived in Scottsdale for 15 years and I'm the chair of the Banner board of directors. I believe Scottdale is the premier city in Arizona because of consistently smart long-term land use decisions. Tonight's my first night back in this room 25 years ago. I'm really dating myself. I spent a lot of time in here.

I was president of Dell Webb and along with other large developers like DMB and others at that time 25 years ago we were conceiving and building the iconic Scottsdale communities in Mcdow Mountain Ranch, Greyhawk, DC Ranch, Silverleaf and I was at the time appointed by the council to help lead the general plan update that preceded the 2035 plan that you um have recently approved. Thank goodness because we got a little outdated. A lot happened between 2020 2000 and 2020.

But when we had that general plan update, the 101 was just getting started. Scottdale's frontage on the 101 was a blank and empty canvas. But when we planned just as you have in 2035, we looked 20 years out. That's our job as good planners, as good commissioners, as good council members, and good corporate citizens. And I think Scottsdale's done a magnificent job grounding its foundation in the general plan while fine-tuning as circumstances arise.

We are the greatest community in Arizona, in my view, one of the greatest communities in the country. I'm so proud to live here. I'm proud to have helped fight for the McDall Sonorin Land preserve and all of the other great things that Scottdale is. But when we plan and prioritize land use, we're always thinking about services for our residents, not just what the developers want at that moment. It's about thinking ahead and what will Scottsdale need today, 10 years, and 20 years from now.

Back then, we didn't know where exactly the next hospital would be built, so we didn't put it in the general plan on the 101, but we certainly knew that in 20 years there'd be a need. I think Amy talked about all the boxes that this hospital ticks at the big picture of good quality development that adds value care services to residents. But I also want you to know one other thing. I spent eight years on the Honor Health Board of Directors as well. I have immense respect for both organizations.

I'm a patient and customer of both. Both are not forprofit community health systems and both have a mission to improve patient access and quality care. What I'm not proud of are some of the political tactics that have been utilized to influence you and others. We're all better than that. Let's rise above that.

Back when we proposed the Honor Thompson Peak Hospital 20 years ago, there wasn't an existing hospital system competitively standing in the way saying, "Not in my backyard for this little reason and that little reason." It sailed through and 20 years later, we are all a better community for it. Miss Mary Chief, if you could please wrap. I see this decision in the same light. Today, nobody says health accessing health care is easy.

Whether it's an ER, a specialist, a life ordeath situation where minutes matter, this campus is consistent with your attention to detail and the long view. Its impact will be measured in life saved over decades. Appreciate all the work you do. Value you and appreciate your support. Thank you. Thank you so much, Mr. Riley. Hello. Um, thank you. Uh, my name is Bob Riley, Mr. Chairman and, uh, commissioners. I'm a heart surgeon at Honor Health. I've been practicing in Scottsdale for 21 years.

I am the chief of cardiovascular surgery and, um, medical director for the Honor Health cardiovascular care. I wanted to make one point. Um, Scottsdale is not underserved when it comes to complete heart care for our residents. Cardiovascular care at Honor Health alone is provided by 78 physicians, over 35 advanced practice providers, and over 558 staff members to uh cover our residents. This is not an access problem to expert care in Scottsdale.

In fact, right here, patients have access to elite medical expertise and surgical care. We have highly trained contingent of cardiovascular and thoracic surgeons with who focus on heart surgery, lung surgery and blood vessel surgery and diseases. Our experts have migrated here from all corners of the globe. We have staffed our Scottsdale clinics and hospitals with with experts trained at the likes of Stanford, Duke, Mayo, Harvard, Cleveland, and Colombia.

In the realm of heart surgery, we perform every type of adult heart surgery imaginable with the exception of transplant. and that's covered by Mayo Clinic. We have multiple years of double-digit growth in our surgical program and our volume has um included patients who have traveled from all over the valley, the state and surrounding state uh to seek their healthcare at a Scottsdale facility. We can and do meet this demand.

In addition to the complex cardiovascular surgery, we have a wide array of other expertise and world-renowned experts in all aspects of cardiovascular medicine including complex coronary intervention, structural heart disease and electrophysiology. We have specialists in clinics in women's cardiovascular health, cardioetrics, cardiooncology, cardioabolic disease, cardiogenetics, um sports medicine, blue zone care, pres preventative cardiology and lifestyle medicine.

Your expert is here in Scottsdale. You don't have to travel somewhere else and we will never transfer you out to a downtown facility. You'll get your care here. To augment our care, we have a robust research institute that has uh provided over 70 active clinical trials with dozens of publications in the last year in many uh prestigious medical journals. Um we feel that we practice at the highest levels and offer services that are only available in a few elite centers in the United States.

uh is for this reason we uh oppose the um the expansion of the hospital in North Scottsdale and uh ask that you vote no to the reasonzoning request. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Riley. Mr. Roga, following Mr. Roga, uh David Rizett, additional one minute for four minutes. Uh Mr. Michael Herring and Mr. Richard uh Swedberg. So, if you could just be ready, I'd appreciate it. Mr. Roga. Thank you. Good evening. Mr. Chairman and planning committee members, thank you for having us this evening.

Uh, my name is Alan Roga. Oh, yeah. Sorry. I just want to make sure as we have everybody come up here, if you could please say your name like you just did and your address just so that we get that on the record. Thank you. You bet. Full address. Yes. And And you get three minutes. By the way, I just took 15. I'll I'll be good. 10865 East Coast Avenue, Scottsdale, Arizona. I've been here for over 30 years. I love living in Scottsdale and I come here as a private citizen.

I have no professional gain for speaking here tonight. Um, but I do come here because I have a unique lens. Uh, I've been in healthcare for over 35 years, both as a tech entrepreneur and as emergency room physician. I've built tech companies, startups to large companies. Uh, and as an ER physician, I've been president of the Arizona College of Emergency Physicians. I don't practice anymore. Uh, I worked at Honor Health when it was the Scotsdale Healthcare for about 15 years.

But but again, I I have no personal or professional gain for being here other than being a concerned citizen. Uh you've heard some of the comments, but I'll give you a little bit of a different lens, I think, because I've worked with nearly 400 hospitals across the United States. We have excellent care here. Um it's one of the main reasons I love living here. Uh and I tell people all the time, we have phenomenal care here in the community. And I don't want to say anything to disrupt that.

Um there are three main points I would make. One is, you've heard before, we're not underserved. I've seen what that looks like throughout the country. We do not have that here. The other is, as an ER physician, and I've redesigned hospitals around emergency rooms. One critical factor for emergency rooms is that you need repetitions. You need that pressure. You need that volume to build those systems and processes that allow for high pressure thinking.

And it's shown that when you don't have that, the outcomes are worse. and people suffer. And the third thing I would tell you is that um not only are physicians in shortage and need, but nurses, technicians, social workers, and all the people that staff the hospitals in addition, the specialists that you need for cardiac care, stroke care, neuro care. Why would we dilute scarce resources that already are limited in capacity with another system in the area that is not needed? It will impact care.

it will impact the community. I don't want to see anything jeopardize that. We are not underserved and I would highly recommend that we not look at this project uh and do anything that would jeopardize the great care that we have here. For any questions I can answer, I'm happy to do so. I got in under your three minutes. Thank you, Mr. Roen. Appreciate I'll give my 46 46 seconds to the next person. [laughter] Uh Mr. Rizik, uh four minutes. four minutes and 45 seconds. Mr.

Chairman, vice chair, commissioners. My name is Dr. David Risac and you might say that I am the seniormost cardiovascular specialist in Scottdale. I've been here for 33 years. I'm probably the most veteran and that's more than just a function of my age. Um, and I've enjoyed the 33 years that I spent at Honor Health. I've met a great deal of really terrific physicians. Recently, I joined Banner University.

And I joined Banner University to see this project through because as a practicing physician of 33 years, I know just how at capacity and over capacity we are. And every single physician in this room has lived this. When Mayo left Honor Health uh two decades ago, I established the cardiology division as it is today. The research group and I've overseen that research group. Many of the uh publications Dr. Riley spoke of are mine.

And the cardiovascular education program, I established that and oversaw that for the last three decades. And we all know that Scottsdale has thrived. But I can assure you that access to highquality, high acuity critical care beds has in fact lagged behind. We've all been in the emergency room. We've all been in the operating room and waited for beds to become available. Now, someone showed the 30,000 foot view just a moment ago, and I want to thank him.

But I'm going to take you from 30,000 feet right down to planet Earth because from 30,000 feet you see this cluster of hospitals but and we talked about hospital beds but not all beds are created equal. Let me give you some examples. Mayo Clinic for instance. Mayo Clinic for most of my professional career has not accepted many of the insuranceances of Scottsdale patients including and especially Medicare. Thompson Peak a fantastic hospital. I have loved working there.

Great doctors, great nurses. But if you enter there with a heart attack or a stroke and I was part of this decisionmaking because of the volume there, it's a little bit more more boutique. oftentimes strokes and heart attacks are transferred to other hospitals. They don't have 247 coverage all the time for these. In fact, for strokes, you're going to be sent to Osborne, which is the epicenter of stroke and neurosurgery.

So, I think you can see when you look at this, while you see from 30,000 ft a lot of hospitals and hospital beds, not all beds are created equal. I was surprised that Dr. Riley brought up operating rooms and CVOS. I respect the work that these surgeons do, but nine Honor Health Hospitals and there are two cardiovascular OS where they perform bypass surgery and one is at Deer Valley at Interstate 17. That's hardly a Scottsdale centric uh institution.

You know better than I the meteoric growth that this community has seen. And you also know because you've done your homework that many of us are baby boomers. I'm 67. Okay. Those born between 1949 and 1964. There is going to be an explosion of health care needs. So, as one woman said, it's not just about today, but we're planning for tomorrow. and the baby boomers are going to come of age very quickly. I'm going to leave you with one last story and please forgive me for going over.

Shortly before I left Honor Health, there was a day when I was in the emergency room and this was not unusual. We had a surfet of patients coming in, high acuity patients because of lack of access, because of lack of beds. And this is not a reflection on the doctors and nurses at Honor Health. These excellent doctors and nurses can't manufacture beds and resources when we are already at capacity. 28 patients left the hospital that day unseen in the emergency room because we are over capacity.

Not all beds are created equal. So if that's one of your family members, your mother, your father, and they are turned away, I I think that's that would be awful. I just printed this before I came. If you could wrap up your thoughts, sir, please. Two seconds. The average wait time at Sheay today was 174 minutes. National average 134 minutes. If that's your family member, I promise you as a veteran cardiologist, those 40 minutes could mean the difference between life and death.

I know you have very significant deliberations. I wish for you God's good counsel. I know you're going to act with wisdom. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Herring. Thank you, sir. Uh, Mr. uh, Swedenberg. Uh, I'm fine with that. If you have one more minute of conversation or you can just say you agree with them either way. Great. Thank you. [laughter] All right, one minute, but let's keep it tight. Never saw a microphone I didn't like.

I have maintained my privileges at Honor Health and I intend to continue working at Honor Health. Dr. Kelpie is going to talk. He and I operated together Sunday morning for three hours. These two institutions, these two systems cannot be thought of as being in competition but rather collaboration with each other. These are complimentary institutions designed to do one thing for the men and women of Scottsdale to to answer the health care needs of Scottsdale.

And I think this idea of competition has to end. And that's all I'll say. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Isaac. Dan Isaac, address on record. Um, I'd like to start by actually commending the chair and the commission for actually maintaining respect and proper uh etiquette during this meeting. I'm in this ka quite often and I don't see it from our city council. So, thank you for treating everybody with respect. Um, I am a member of an honor health family.

All of my doctors, all my specialists, my PCP, the times that there I've had outpatient or my husband had inpatient needs, we were at Honor Health. Despite that, I'm here to speak on behalf of Banner. I believe that the remitt of the planning commission comes down to a simple fact, land use. Is the applicant correctly using the land? Is it compliant with the law? And will it benefit Scottsdale? I think the answer to those two questions is yes.

And unfortunately, we've got quite a bit of people not talking about that, but rather wanting to defend Honor Health's monopoly. Now, I'm a free market capitalist. I believe competition is a good thing. Any belief that competition leads to bad quality or increased price has been proven wrong throughout history. And if I were on her health, I'd be fighting against this as well. But this is not the remitt of the planning commission.

You are to decide whether the the land use is correct and good for Scottsdale. I think if anybody looks at providing more medical choice to the employee to the residents of Scottsdale, that would be an appropriate use and good for Scottsdale. Now, we hear that there's a shortage of doctors and nurses and that this is going to somehow exacerbate it, but actually it could help it because there would be an additional employer. Not everybody wants to work for Honor Health.

Some want to work for Banner. So, this could attract more. Not to mention Banner is training and educating health care professionals. We also hear that there is no need. But Honor Health actually, if I can have the overhead for a minute, admits that there's a need in this presentation. Can we zoom that at all? Yeah, please, if we could. I'm having a hard time seeing these small exhibits.

So, Honor Health submitted that there is a projected shortage in five and 10 years, but they believe that only they should fill that need. Now, I'm sorry, that's not what the land use is supposed to decide. If Hilton wants to build a hotel, Marriott doesn't get to say, "No, you don't get to do it because we want to build another hotel." And then lastly, this belief that there is no need because of Mayo. As the gentleman pointed out, I'm a benefits actuary.

Insurance decides where you can and cannot go. So, no, the Mayo Clinic is not an option for most of us. So, please make the decision based on what's good for the residents of Scottsdale, what's good for the employees. And by the way, the entire growth in this area is the North Phoenix and North Scottsdale, both from an employer perspective, commercial, industrial, and residential. We will need more hospital capacity. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Isaac. Uh, Steve Hong, and then Troy Fribid.

Good evening, chair, vice chair, and commissioners, and thank you for all you do. My name is Steve Han. I live at 10917 East Daddy Way, about as far north as you can go in Scottsdale. My kids say it's Flagstaff, but that's that's where I live. Um, so I'm very familiar with what we're talking about and this location. Um, my family has lived in Arizona for over 16 years with the majority in Scottsdale. All three of my children attended Scottsdale schools. My wife is a school teacher in Scottsdale.

One just graduated from U of A off the payroll. Yes. The other one's a junior at ASU. Why am I telling you this? We're very invested in the city of Scottsdale and the state of Arizona. So, this is really important to me. Um, I work for Taylor Morrison. Uh, so land use is near and dear to my heart. I'm not going to focus on that. The experts are focusing on that here tonight.

I'm going to focus more on a a reference, a character reference if you will, a banner through a project I did with them over the last three years, as well as my personal support of this project as a resident, not a employee of Banner or not as an employee of Honor Health. Um, a bit more about Taylor Morrison, the connection to this project though before I get into that. Uh Taylor Morrison is headquartered in Scottsdale, Chapperel and Scottsdale Road, right up the road.

Uh we've been here since our inception. We love being here. We're a national company. We're incredibly invested in the market as well. Uh so we care about these things. Uh projects we've done in Scottsdale include Story Rock, Copper Sky, Enclave on the E, Mirabbel Village, and Andaloosa, just to name a few. Every one of these projects, our customers would most likely use this facility. They're all north of the 101 in North Scottsdale. Yes, they could use Thompson Peak.

Yes, they could use possibly Mayo, but for some of the reasons I heard earlier, uh there are challenges with that, whether it be Medicare, whether it be insurance or what have you. Um, a farther connection between us and the Banner Group for a reference or a character reference would be a philanthropic project I was fortunate enough to work with with the Banner team.

Uh, we teamed with Banner on a long-term housing cancer and uh, long-term care uh, housing project down at their Higgleian 60 Cancer Center. Uh, you might have seen this. It was called Home Away from Home and it aired on um, Extreme Makeover Home Edition. It was really good for trying to get the word out. We jointly built eight 1,000 square foot, two-bedroom, two- bath, detached units and a 2,000 foot wellness center.

Uh really the the genesis of this was for folks that are coming in to use this cancer center um and don't have the funds, the the wherewithal to um pay for housing. They're here for a month, they're here for six weeks, what have you. These facil these eight units are based on need are given free of charge to these cancer patients. So phenomenal opportunity um through that simply our my experience with Banner on this project was I'm almost done. I'm sorry. Uh was phenomenal.

Great people uh behind the name. Um they really value people in community and they're very philanthropic. I support this project. Why? Safety is the top of the list. Some of my neighbors again, North Scottsdale often go to Osborne. I heard that earlier. That happens. I I don't know about care levels or what have you, but it does feel to me like we have need. Um I believe in collaboration as well as competition. And again, I thank you for your time and what you do for the citizens of Scottsdale.

In closing, I I ask for your support of the proposed zoning map amendment and the conditional use of per uh permit to enable this project to become a reality. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. on Mr. Freeman. Uh, Chair Scarbor and planning commissioners, first of all, as a resident, uh, want to thank you. We've had a chance to get to know each other quite a bit over the past few months talking about this project. And you don't have an easy job.

I don't envy you, but I am grateful for the service you provide to our community. So, let me start with that. My name is Troy Freeman. I'm vice president of real estate at Banner Health. My wife, two daughters, and I have lived in North Scottsdale, just a few miles from our proposed site, for the past 12 years. I've been on the front lines of this project for Banner since day one. In my nearly 5 years, we've developed dozens of healthc care projects throughout Arizona.

Every one of them, including this hospital, has one thing in common. They were all absolutely necessary, and our track record proves that. Banner Health is a nonprofit health system. We would not invest significant funds to develop any facility without carefully analyzing why it's needed. That's where this project started. Here the math is simple. Like it or not, people will continue to move to Scottsdale in the Northeast Valley. The census estimates show this. We won't belabor those facts.

The current and future neighbors, each of them growing older by the day, will need increased health care services, hospital beds, specialty care, and the best cardiology anywhere in Arizona. This is a simple fact, even if Honor Health wants to dispute it. And here are some other inconvenient facts to the opposition. In November 2022, Banner sought to purchase a different 48acre parcel at Hayden Road and Loop 101 to build this hospital.

Honor Health showed up at that auction and drove the price dramatically higher, ultimately paying $90 million in cash for land that was valued at 56 million. Honor Health publicly then stated it had no plans for the land. Since then, they've engaged attorneys, public relations consultants, the local firefighters union to prevent Banner Health from moving this project forward. Not because of land use impacts, not to protect neighbors, but to prevent competition.

In one key respect, this hospital is unlike any project I've ever worked on. Never has a health care system gone to such lengths to oppose another provider entering a market expanding access to care in a community. Health care systems compete every day in America, but they don't try to block patient access leveraging a planning process.

Our city, as you know very well, has seen a number of controversial projects in recent times, including the Axon case, and Honor Health has never publicly opposed a single one. The only project they fought is the one that would compete with them directly. Thank you for your time. Thank you, Mr. Freeman. Next three speakers are Todd Werner, Chris Schaefner, and Michael Gordon. Mr. Werner. Uh, my name is Todd Werner. I live at uh 18720 North 101st Street.

And I speak in uh support of this application for a few reasons. Number one, I believe that it's going to continue to enhance health care in the um city that I've called home for over 17 years, and that means a lot to me. Second, customers and consumers want choice. I believe in that firmly. I heard that earlier as well. This project is also going to help access. We've heard a lot about that as well.

And then finally, in closing, I'm going to talk about the competition results in superior services, products, and outcomes. And so, in closing, it really makes everything better. And so, I very much support this project. I appreciate the time. Thank you, sir. Mr. Shaner, good evening. My name is Chris Schoffner. I uh live in Scottville at 7346 East Sunnyside Drive. Uh lived here most of my life. Um start by saying a few things.

I've used Honor Health Services um countless times my entire life here. Uh my son was born at Honor Health and um I've had family members that have received great care at Honor Health uh as well. But, you know, Honor Health doesn't have a inherent right to me as a customer um any more than Banner does. Quite frankly, it's it's my choice as to who I choose, who my family members choose for their care, who loved ones, who anybody in the city of Scotsdale chooses. It should be their choice.

Um, and for whatever the suggestion is that this somehow infringes on on her health, um, I'm not sympathetic to that. I'm not sympathetic to that based on the principle that I just mentioned that they have no right to us individually other than our willingness to use their their health care. Uh and secondly, from a professional standpoint, I've worked in a performance-based industry, paid my entire career based on my performance against competitors.

Um I learned long ago, pay attention to your own product, make it your own product and service as strong as you can and and don't worry about trying to block, if you will, the the competition. Um, so yes, I I've been a little surprised that that Honor Health has been vocal um against this. I didn't know Dr. Risac was going to be here this evening. Uh, he doesn't he won't recognize me or know me, but he does my father quite well.

[snorts] Um, he's provided exceptional care for him, uh, life-saving care for him for some time. And, um, my father is following him and, uh, he's doing so because that makes the most sense for him. and I certainly understand why he uh finds that to be a need. We've talked about a few things and I'll try and wrap up here in the last minute about hospital beds and things like that. I'll just point out a couple of facts. We have fewer hospital beds today than we did in the 1970s.

And um that's fine if you're going to a surgery center to have a knee done or whatever. But when you need a hospital, you actually need a hospital, not a surgery center or a dialysis clinic or anything of the sort. Um so that becomes something that that becomes very important. And as other people have pointed, we need to build for the future, not for right now. When it comes to healthcare, you don't put up hospital quickly. They're years and decades in in some cases.

Um, finally, as far as the number of beds in Scottsdale, that the health care facilities here don't just serve Scottsdale. Where do you go in Fountain Hills if you need a hospital or Carefree or Cave Creek or the Indian Reservation or Phoenix, just the other side of the of the border? Um, we need I believe we need the the health care options here in Scottsdale.

Um, Banner brings a lot uh and some things that that Honor Health doesn't and can't offer like its teaching capacities, fellowship programs, things like that that matters uh for our city. So, as a Scottsdale resident, I would ask you to approve this and expand the choices of health care for Scottsdale residents. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. [clears throat] Schoffner. Uh, Mr. Mr. Gordon, I'm sorry. You are res.

Do you have that that individual on the list and can you I I don't know that I'm going to need it, but I'm happy to not have the pressure. Thank you, Louise. Yeah, there you go. Um, Chairman Scarboro, Commissioners, I'm Dr. Michael Gordon, residing at 9693 North 113 Way here in Scottsdale. I've been a Scottsdale resident for the past 25 and a half years.

I am a medical oncologist on staff at Honor Health serving our Scottsdale community and I am a pancreatic cancer survivor thanks to the advances in care established at the Honor Health Research Institute and at Honor Health.

Um in my present role I am the chief medical officer of the honor health research institute where I oversee the conduct of medical and translational research studies in specialties of cancer cardiovascular disease neurosciences beriatric GI and pulmonary and rheumatic disorders. It highlights the vast array of work that we do at honor health stipulating in many ways as was articulated by Dr. Ryzek, we are not just a community hospital.

As evidence of that, we have people who come to Honor Health from 50 states and 36 countries around the world. And the honor health research institute is one of the major reasons why we have now joined with honor with ASU to create the ASU John Shufeld School of Medicine and Medical Engineering.

My personal research focuses uh on the treatment of rare cancers such as saroma and melanoma as well as the use of investigational or experimental drugs for the treatment of patients with relapsed and refractory cancer. I performed my residency in internal medicine at the University of Chicago and my fellowship in hematology oncology at Memorial Sloan cancer can Sloanketering Cancer Center in New York before serving on the faculty at Indiana University in IU cancer center for nine years.

In uh 2001, I came to Scottdale as the associate dean for research for the UA College of Medicine Phoenix before there was a College of Medicine Phoenix and with Dr. Jackie Chadwick developed the floor plan and the platform for that. Um, subsequent to that, um, we started our research program for the Arizona Cancer Center, Greater Phoenix area at Scottsdale Healthcare because of the forethought and vision of Max Pole and others at the University of Arizona.

And we ultimately privatized that program and then rolled it back to the Honor Health Research Institute. I am the co-author on almost 200 peer-reviewed studies across a vast array of clinical trials and I've had the opportunity to work with Banner in the past. I was actually the person who recommended Gateway Hospital for Banner MD Anderson when the decision was made to ride those coattails to try and develop an outstanding cancer program.

Scottsdale is not underserved when it comes to cancer care. I've had the opportunity to aid in the development and support the evolution of the honor health cancer care network comprised of over 80 medical oncologists gynon oncologists and advanced practitioners a citywide hospital-based activity that is under the opaces of honor health we treat over 35% of all newly diagnosed cancer patients in maricopa county.

And in fact, approximately 45% of cancer patients receive some degree of treatment um at Honor Health during their cancer journey. We make it a priority that patients get access to care within 3 to five days of calling for an appointment. Mr. Gordon, if you could wrap up your comments, please. Absolutely. The Honor Health Virginia G. Hyper Cancer Center in Scottsdale was the first comprehensive cancer program that wrapped all degrees of cancer care under one roof.

It serves as the flagship for our treatment where our phase one program lives and we enroll between 250 and 300 patients annually. It's important to note that almost 90% of cancer care is done on an outpatient basis. Banner MD Anderson will be able to provide cancer services to the Banner outpatient in the Banner Banner outpatient medical building currently being built on the site under the existing zoning.

Adding another acute care hospital is not going to provide any additional oncology services and therefore I would urge a vote of no to the modification of the zoning. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Gordon. Uh so we have next Sasha Weller. But before uh Miss Weller speaks, uh two things I want to make sure everybody knows that we have received a lot of written comments and they've all been reviewed by the planning commission. So they are heard and appreciated. Thank you very much.

Two, it's been recommended and I agree that at 7:00 we're going to take a pause because we have still a number of speakers and then we have deliberation afterwards. So Mr. Curtis, what do you think a recommended time? 10 minutes at 7 o'clock or after this speaker would be a fivem minute speaker. Yes, Mr. Chairman, that sounds good. Okay. Thank you. Looking for Sasha Weller. Oh, yes, sir. Good evening. Uh my name is Sasha Weller and I guess we're talking about how long we've lived here.

So, my family's been in Arizona prior to the Gadson purchase. Uh been a resident of this community for 50 years and I proudly served as a professional firefighter for the past 30 years. My name is Sasha Weller. I'm the president of the Scottsdale Firefighters Association, 1916 North 72nd Place. I'm here as a resident. I'm here as a taxpayer and I'm here as a professional firefighter. I'm not getting paid to be here.

Uh I have no economic interest or or have ever had any economic interest in honor health or the outcome of this case. I'm here because [clears throat] I care about the quality of healthcare in our city. The Scottsdale General Plan adopted by voters in 2021 is more than a legal framework. It's a reflection of our community's priorities. Among most among the most significant additions is the healthy community element created through extensive public outreach.

The element includes a clear health care goal and I quote promote access to health and human services for citizens of Scottsdale. This was intentional. While state law does not require such provisions, Scottsdale has long embraced community created elements starting with the 2001 general plan to ensure our policies reflect what residents value the most.

The 2035 update strengthened this commitment by adding detailed healthcare policies considering policy HC1.1 which supports the development, preservation and enhancement of critical health care facilities particularly in un underserved areas and policy HC 1.2 which calls for the collaboration with public and private partners to maintain prehosp emergency medical care and advanced life support programs.

These policies recognize that healthc care planning is not like approving another big box store. Uh all due respect to all the folks that have talked about competition, there are nuances to healthcare and we need to consider that. The general plan explicitly assigns the city a role in working with healthcare administrators to ensure facilities are the right size, location, and quality to meet the community's needs. Our community's needs are are over at this point.

Today, those needs, both current and future, are already being met by existing providers. Adding another hospital will not provide it will not improve our care. Instead, it'll be detrimental to the limited pool of medical professionals and the quality of services that we we now enjoy as as residents of this community. Bannon Health's proposal does not address an underserved or meaningful improved improvement to hospital services in North Scottsdale.

Rather than responding to a demonstrated community need, this initiative appears to be driven primarily to serve the greater northeast Phoenix area. The general plan gives us a clear directive. Healthcare planning must serve Scottsdale residents. I urge you to uphold that vision and ensure that decisions align with policies of our that our voters have approved. And if I can take just a minute and I'll I'll I'll be out in just a second. I want to share with you uh really personally.

I'm sure that many of you have seen over the past couple years the uh the epidemic that we're facing in the fire service with firefighter cancer. All of our members are treated at honor facilities. There's a reason for that. There's an absolute reason for that. It's the best care that you're going to get. We don't we we are perfectly well served by our hospital system. I appreciate your time. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Waller. Uh so with that uh we're going to go ahead and take a 10-minute pause.

And as we pause, just want to remind the commissioners uh this is not an opportunity to deliberate or discuss the case. We are still actively in it. Uh so just as a reminder, we'll see everybody back here in 10 minutes. begin again. Thank you. Well, thank you everybody. I really appreciate how civil everybody's being. Uh really appreciate all the comments for and against. This has been uh very informative. So next three speakers we have Shirley Wagner, Barbara Stein, and Rex Porter.

Miss Wagner, if you'd like to start us off, please. Oh, I apologize. Thank you, Mr. Mc Williams. I got that out of order. Miss Wagner, go ahead. But then after her, it'll be Malik Shay. Okay. Mr. Commissioner, uh, Mr. Chairman and Commissioners, my name is Shirley Wagner, 7468 East Quill, 85255. My relationship with Honor Health goes back to 1977 when I started working at Scottsdale Memorial Hospital as a nuclear medicine technologist.

The system has had name changes over the years, but quality patient care has always been top priority. The physicians that practice at the hospital are innovative and forwardthinking. Upon retiring, I continued my relationship with Honor Health by volunteering at the Thompson Peak campus, which has serves North Scottville for almost 20 years. As a longtime and involved resident of Scottsdale, I'm opposed to the construction of a Banner Hospital at Hayden in the 101. It simply is not needed.

The Northos the North Scottsdale area already has the highest quality hospitals with plenty of proven bed capacity and the expertise to meet our health care needs now and decades into the future. Scottsdale Thompson Peak has earned magnet designation. This is the highest national designation for excellence in nursing care. Honor Health accepts all major insuranceances, so Scottsdale residents do not need to travel out of the area to access highquality health care.

An unnecessary hospital will not create more physicians, nurses, technologists, therapists, but rather it's going to strain the workforce. Some health care facilities have already felt it necessary to implement significant hiring bonuses to recruit these health care professionals. I also have concerns about the increased traffic volume that this pro proposed hospital will create. Another personal issue for me is a strain on our water supply.

I hope that this planning commission will say no, will put the Scottsdale residents first and say no to an unwanted and unneeded hospital near Hayden and the 101. Thank you for your time. Thank you, Mr. Sheay. Dr. Shay, I do apologize. Thank you. Uh, Chairman Scarboro, commissioners, thank you for giving me the opportunity to speak today. My name is Mollik Shaw. I live at 6449 East Gainesboro Road, Scottsdale, Arizona. I am an interventional cardiologist.

Um, unlike some of my other colleagues here, I actually grew up here locally in uh in Scottsdale, Phoenix. I went to school at Rancho Solano and then Brophy. I went to Stanford after that from college and then did my training there. and I returned here because my passion is to build a great medical community and practice here in Scottsdale, Arizona. I have lived here now for nearly 17 years.

I founded a clinic or group called Atria Heart that started with two physicians and has grown to 25 physicians with multiple locations within Scottsdale. I um also serve as the executive director of the cardiovascular center of excellence at Honor Health. My goal is very simple is to make sure that our community has access and my family has access to the best possible care available.

I strongly believe that adding another hospital here in Scottsdale is unnecessary and not only is it unnecessary but at risk harming what already works. My concerns stem around quality, the workforce and the impact to the community. First, I believe another hospital definitely will fragment care and threaten quality. Great outcomes come from experienced teams that have coordinated programs.

Scottsdale already has built strong centers of excellence within the cardiovascular world, oncology, cancer care, emergency medicine, and complex surgery. Another hospital splits patients in teams and can definitely weaken outcomes. This has been seen nationally. Second, as was just alluded to, definitely this could strain the workforce by having another hospital here. Hospitals run on people, not buildings. Our Arizona already faces a shortage of nurses and essential staff.

A new hospital will not create new clinicians. It will just pull from the same limited pool and increase instability across every health system. Third, this new hospital will likely be redundant and burdens the city. Scottsdale already has a high concentration of beds in comparison to other places. Another hospital will duplicate services while increasing traffic, congestion, and strain on infrastructure. Fourth, this one's important.

This likely does, this new hospital likely will not advance complex care in Scottsdale. Banner has a reputation of functioning such that they create intake sites from other places and then transfer high acuity patients to their complex other locations outside of Scottsdale. That shifts value outside of Scottsdale and the burden Scottsdale with without the capacity to actually excel in advance patient care. While I ex exhibit these concerns, express these concerns, I want to be clear.

I am very confident in what we have here in Scottsdale already. As director of the cardiovascular program, I see the outcomes. I see the safety performance. I see the recruitment and I see the expertise every day. Scottsdale has three hospitals, nationally recognized institutions, including Honor Health and Mayo Clinic, and strong access compared to the rest of the state. Patients come here through competition because they trust us. The question is not whether health care matters. It does.

The question really is whether another hospital strengthens or weakens what already is what we are already receiving in Scottsdale is excellent care. I believe that a new hospital risk alienating our community and also makes us weaker overall. I know that you will make the best decision overall. I know it's a difficult decision. If there's any other perspective I can add, please let me know. And thank you for your time. Thank you, Dr. Shaw.

I apologize for not saying your name correctly the first time. Uh, Barbara Stein. Mr. Chairman and members of the commission, my name is Barbara Steiner. My uh address is on record. I've lived in Scottsdale for 35 years and care deeply about this community and its future. Banner Health bought this land knowing it was not zoned for hospital use. That zoning exists for a reason. It reflects years of planning and community input.

If we allow zoning changes simply c because a corporation wants them, we risk losing the careful balance that makes Scottsdale such a desirable place to live. Hospitals aren't like retail stores. They require major infrastructure, water, roads, utilities, and emergency services. They impact traffic and staffing across the city. The general plan says the city should help plan facilities that truly meet community needs. Beyond these planning concerns, there is also the financial impact.

A nonprofit hospital on this site would remove valuable property and sales taxes. This would result in a significant loss of revenue for the city. Those dollars fund essential services such as police, fire, and infrastructure. They keep Scottsdale safe and thriving. Granting tax exemptions for a facility that isn't truly needed shifts the burden to residents and businesses who already pay their fair share.

Within a few miles of the proposed Banner Hospital, there are at least four other hospitals within several miles which leads to redundancy in services and potential lack of qualified staff. I am asking you to remain with the vision of our residents who voted for general plan 2021. We need to make decisions that protect Scottsdale quality of life and infrastructure. Thank you very much. Thank you, Mrs. Steiner. Uh Mr. Porter. Rex Porter. Thank you.

I'm going to share one image with you if this could work out here. My name is Rex Porter. I'm a resident of Scottsdale. I live at 36730 uh North Visari Drive. I've lived here for uh in my ninth year. Uh one thing I want to say is um I'm run a small business here in town. I'm a retired Air Force officer. I've lived here for about nine years. Before moving here, I served for a couple years on a planning commission at a county level in Washington State. So, I know what it's like to sit there.

And I just texted my wife that I'm so impressed. We're like three hours into this and you're all still looking at me. That that that's that's a hard thing to carry out. So for no matter how this turns out, I'm impressed with the integrity of what you all are doing and I thank you because a planning commission is is not the most thanked job in the world. So thanks for what you do. Um my position is I'm just here as a resident. I'm proud to live here.

I'm proud to look at this sheet of paper that we that when I moved here, we have this general plan that says community well-being is a value. that we have goals and policies including in the general plan promoting access to health and human services for the city of Scottsdale. So the the tough thing that you all are facing is you're facing these two choices which um it's nice to be wanted and and we've heard a lot of good points today.

what it boils down to for you as planning commissioner is you're looking at land use, you're looking at zoning, you're looking at what's the intent and you haven't planned in front of you and it seems like the strongest point from Banner in making the zoning change is we've got this huge growth coming. I think I saw a number of 100,000 people by 2030.

Huge growth is coming, but if you look at the data, I think the numbers I saw was the city of Scottsdale grew like a thousand people year-over-year. And that was not an anomaly. Scottsdale is not growing greatly. The demand and the numbers that Banner want you to look at is growth outside of Scottsdale. So then as a planning commission what you have to consider is we have a commitment to a plan.

We have a commitment to people like me who are residents and do we want to change the zoning from low inensity residential type of a place to high intensity with all the demands on infrastructure, police, fire, water, power. Do we want to put those burdens on the place that you're responsible for, which is Scottsdale? Do we want to take on that burden to serve a need for 100,000 people that are moving into the valley but not into Scottsdale?

So, what I would ask you to seriously consider is is that trade-off worth it? Should Scottsdale take on the burden of those 100,000 people and the hospital and all the infrastructure burden and and go away from the intent of the plan and change the zoning to serve a need, but it's a need, if you look at the map, it's a need outside of Scottsdale. I'd ask you to consider it. And if I was still on a planning commission, I would say I like Banner. My wife just had foot surgery at Banner.

I don't want them to leave. Um, but I would I would decline the request. I would not change the zone. So, thank you for your time. Thank you, Mr. Porter. Uh, next up we have Ed Neman following Mr. Neman. It's Shiva Birdie. Hopefully, I didn't hurt that one too bad. And then Mr. John Rosenberg. Mr. Neman. Hello, I'm Ed Nean. I live at um 8624 East Via Deloul in Scottsdale. I've been a resident here for over 20 years and um I support Banner and building this facility. Um I think it's a need.

Uh the one attorney earlier stated about unmet need. Well, not everybody has access to um mail and can afford it. So that's one statement. It might be a little bit more traffic when you get off Hayden and 101, but with that I'd rather have a stoplight have to sit through a week as opposed to making sure that we have really good care um in in Scottsdale. and I live only about two miles from the res uh from the new facility. So, I support that and the traffic is a maybe a little bit of an issue.

No worse than the TPC or the Barrett Jackson. Thank you. Thank you, sir. Uh Mr. Birdie, Mr. Bree, I apologize. Good evening, uh Chair Scarboro, commissioners. Um, I'm Dr. Shiva Birdie. I'm CEO for Banner Medical Group. I'm here tonight as a physician, as a father, and as your neighbor. Um, my wife is a physician. Our three daughters have all attended Scottsdale schools. They dance in Scottsdale. Uh, for 15 years, we have called Scottsdale home. This is our community, and I care deeply about it.

I've spent all 15 years at Banner Health. 11 of those at Banner MD Anderson Cancer Center. Over there, we cared for patients, built trusted relationships with their families, and I had the opportunity to hold several leadership roles, including leading the cancer program. During those years, I witnessed our teams develop advanced cancer treatments that changed what was possible for families in Arizona.

People who would have to leave the state could now stay in their own homes and near their homes receive care that was worldclass connected to the best cancer program in the country, perhaps the world as part of our partnership with MD Anderson in Houston. This is what this project is all about. It's not hospital beds. It's not a corporate expansion. It's about keeping families together when it matters the most.

It's about giving Scottsdale patients access to specialists and advanced care without driving across the valley. At Banner, as Amy mentioned, we have a pillar that is focused on wellness. As part of that, we're expanding primary care, preventative care, screening care. It's a huge investment and we're making that in Scottsdale to improve the wellness of the community in Scottsdale.

But hospitals are still required when unexpected things happen or sometimes when expected things are needed for the treatment of cancer, cardiovascular care or other things that require a hospital space. What often happens is patients say, "Is my doctor here? Is my care team here?" Unfortunately, today our Scottsdale patients too often end up at hospitals where their care teams and doctors are not engaged. They're not aware. They're not involved. And that care does get disintegrated.

When that happens, especially for cancer patients, that continuity can mean the difference between good care and the best care. And we all know we want the best care for us and our families. This hospital ensures that our patients are connected to their care teams and their doctors while they are here in Scottsdale and receiving that care in Scottsdale. Even if that means they may need something else that's more advanced that's not offered here.

Those same doctors that are caring for nearly 75,000 patients that live in Scottsdale today. The need is here and it's growing in uh 30 seconds. The Northeast Valley will add a lot more residents and a lot more specialists will be needed here. But most importantly, this is a meaningful choice that Scottsdale families will have. I believe Scottsdale deserves this choice. This is the right project for our community and I respectfully ask for your support. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Birdie.

John Rosenberg. Thank you. I've been waiting so long. I was thinking maybe my cardiologist needs to be here and it turns out he is. [laughter] So, um I uh this isn't um what I'm also realizing this this isn't as much a need issue as it's a land use um item and and from a land use perspective, this checks all the boxes. So, um my name is John Rosenberg. I'm a longtime Scottsdale resident and a longtime Scottsdale business owner. I actually own a commercial real estate firm.

So, I had nothing to do with um medical uh or either of these um groups. Um but I'm I'm here to support progress done the right way. And I want to address why the proposed Banner Hospital is quite simply a no-brainer for Scottsdale. First, healthc care is not a luxury. It's core infrastructure. Cities like Scottsdale compete on quality of life. World class health care is as essential as roads, water, and public safety.

This type of investment ensures residents will have access to top tier close close to home as our population top tier care close to home as our population continues to grow in age. Not me of course, hopefully not. Uh we're fortunate to already have health care providers like Honor Health and Mayo Clinic and this investment only strengthens Scottsdale's ability to serve residents for decades. Second, this is one of the cleanest forms of economic development a city can attract.

Hospitals create hundreds of high-paying jobs, stable jobs, physicians, nurses, technicians, administrators, and those jobs are recession resistant. They don't depend on tourism cycles, conventions, or seasonal spending. Third, this project diversifies Scottsdale's economy in a smart way. We're already strong in hospitality, tourism, and professional services. Adding a major healthcare anchor strengthens our economic base and makes the city more resilient long term.

By the way, I think people forget we have between 11 and 12 million visitors to Scottdale each year. They are using health care as well. So, uh, fourth, highquality health care increases, not decreases surrounding property values. By being near major hospital, it makes an area more desirable for families, professionals, and retirees. It attracts complimentary medical offices and thoughtful commercial development. It elevates the area. Fifth, this is private capital taking on private risk.

Banner is investing over almost a billion dollars of its own money because the data supports it. There's no speculation here. There's no gamble. This is a sophisticated organization making a long-term commitment to Scottsdale. And finally, think about the message it sends. A project like this says Scottsdale is planning for the future. That we are more than just a resort town. That we are a full-ervice city where people can live, work, raise families, and age with dignity.

The question isn't why Scottsdale should support this hospital. It's why wouldn't we? I urge the planning commission to look at this not only through the lens of today's concerns, but through the lens of the next 20 to 30 years. The investment strengthens our city in every meaningful way. Thank you. Thank you. Next three speakers we have is John Snyder, Jim Maguire, and Russ Frank. John Snder, if you would please. Hi, I'm uh John Snyder, general counsel for the Vantile companies.

Our mailing address is 14747 North uh uh North Site. Um I'm here on behalf of Vantile but in support of the Banner Health uh project. We uh we partnered with the Dorito company um to acquire the land, you know, five, six years ago and work closely with Banner on the sale of the property. Um they're a top-notch uh company to work with and did everything they said they were going to do. Um like many of the people here um this is a land use issue.

As I read the wellthoughtout, detailed years in the making planning report um this is not a there's nothing about health care systems, right? This is about what's good for the community, what's good for the land, what's good for the real estate. And this is uh this is what it is. Um we uh we own property right down the street. We've developed property all around the the city and this is just exactly the type of use that we think it would be great for the community.

So, I don't need to reiterate everything that people have said, but just they're excellent organization and I hope Honor Health someday comes in here and presents their land use and and the city looks at that that that use too because this is about what's best for health care, what's best for the community and that's uh having competition. That's looking at uh good growth and looking at something that that um will be there for the community 20 30 years from now.

the investment is significant and will bring sign significant returns back to uh the city. So I strongly urge you to look at this from a real estate perspective, from a land use perspective and support this project to vote yes to it. Thank you. Thank you, Jim Magcguire. Yeah. Hi, my name is Jim Magcguire. I produce the annual Scottsdale Yoga Festival.

It's one of the largest outdoor wellness experiences in the country and it takes place right outside the door here at the Civic Center and Banner Health makes that event possible. When I came up with the idea for this, you may remember the Civic Center was a pile of dirt and u no one really saw the vision of what what we could do there. So I I reached out to I don't know maybe 50 different large brands, companies, local businesses including Honor Health and they all said no.

um they did they they didn't see the vision. They didn't want to support it. And so I respect their decision, but I I knew there must be someone out there. So I kept calling and I finally got a hold of Don Stanziano with Banner Health and he actually took my call and I pitched what we were talking about and he gave me an enthusiastic yes. He said yes. And the reason he gave me was he said this align with our values. this aligns with our mission.

We're here to support the health and wellness of the community. Um, so we're so they were on board. They've been the presenting sponsor. This will now be our third year on March 14th. If there any yogis in the room, come join us on March 14th. But I'm here just in support of Banner. My experience with them, my uh is that they do what they say they're going to do. They've been great to work with.

The other thing that when um I pitched this to them that Don was so excited about, he said, "This is a great way to support our employees, our associates to create a team building." So that was like the forefront um of their mind. How do we support our employees? How do we support the community? And they've done so. They've been fantastic to work with.

So, I just want to come out tonight and just this isn't I have no no um knowledge of land use or zoning or anything, but I do know people and I really believe in the organization and I I support what um what they're trying to do. Thank you. Thank you, sir. Russ Frank. Hi, Russ Funk. Uh 108 61 East Fanfall Lane, Scottsdale. And I'll be brief because I can't state it any better than what Dr. Birdie stated, the care that we provide at Banner. What I will state is my personal standpoint.

I moved here seven years ago and within a year of moving here, my sister got diagnosed with stomach cancer. She compared the hospitals in the city because it opened up Scottsdale for her to get care and she ended up getting surgery at the Banner MD Anderson. It would have been great to have a Banner hospital local and able to take her there without traveling 35 minutes to get to the hospital to have her cared for and that care.

She is now six years cancer-free and we I believe that it truly made a difference having her treated here at Banner. So, I do appreciate everything Banner does from that standpoint. Thank you. Thank you, sir. Next three speakers we have uh Kelly Cabarell, Jason Bezos, Bezoso I hope I didn't and Donna Stickler. So Kelly Cabarell please. I don't know if I see Miss Cabraw. We'll put a pin for that one. Uh Jason Bezoso. Hi, good evening uh Mr. Chairman, members of the commission.

My name is Jason Bizo. I live at 3615 North Granite Reef Road. I've been a resident of Scottsdale for 34 years now. I moved here 36 years ago from the East Coast that I love Arizona. I think it's provided a great opportunity to me and other members of my family. Um, Arizona's economy is based on a free and fair market. I wanted to make that point because I think that's the bedrock of our economy and what contributes to our success. And it's the reason why so many people move here.

When I first moved here in 1990, the state population was 3.6 million people. Today, it's 7.6 million people. If the past is any indicator of the future, I know it's not a crystal ball, but this state's going to continue to grow. and health care services are going to are will need to continue to make investments in health care system because there's going to be a tremendous demand for health care services. Um my other point that I want to make is that uh I work at Banner Health.

I'm the VP of government relations. So I wanted to um also disclose that um not not just a resident but I also work for Banner. Banner is a wonderful company. I just celebrated 19 years there at the end of last year. Um each and every day we have an internal website for our employees that we recognize for their work and contributions to the organization.

Almost daily you can see that somebody is celebrating 20 years at Banner, 25 years at Banner, 30 years at Banner, 35 years at Banner, sometimes even 40 years. I think that speaks volumes of the company that um Banner is. It's a wonderful place. uh our team members are there each and every day for patients on their worst possible day in their life. Um I think those are the kind of companies that we want to continue to invest in and see grow in our community.

Thank you for your service um and your contributions to keeping this community a safe place to live, a wonderful place to live. I'm out constantly in the evening walking my dog and I just love this community. So thank you for that and uh urge your support for this project. Thank you, sir. Next on the list is Donna Sickler. Hello. Uh, thank you for the opportunity to speak up as a resident. Uh, Mr. Chair, vice chair, and commissioners. My name is Donna Sickler.

I live at 13025 East Buckskin Road, Scottsdale 85259. Um, I uh I've heard varying statistics and do know that I experience challenges with access to care. My husband needs surgery and was told the earliest that they can get him in is March 9th. So, just as a consumer of both Honor Health and Banner, I do think that we need access to care. We do need the services in our community and I ask that you please consider approving Banner Health's request to serve our community here in Scottsdale.

Thank you. Thank you. So that would actually finish this up if Miss Kelly Caball is not here. So one more call for Miss Kelly Cavall. Okay, we're going to go ahead and close public comment at this time and we'll let the applicants now have an opportunity to respond to public comment. Thank you, Chair Scarough and members of the commission. I will be brief. Um, you've heard a lot of discussion tonight. You know, we haven't had the opportunity to have a conversation with you yet.

And so I think that's where we want to, you know, move this this hearing along. Um I I want to make just a couple quick points. There are two overriding themes that I've heard in the public comment tonight. And one of the most overarching discussion points is you have a competitive health care system arguing that Banner does not need to come into this market. Um, we think healthcare choice is a good thing.

Our data shows differently that these beds are needed, that this hospital can be staffed and served. Um, we don't think that that is um the crux of what should be on the docket here tonight. Um, you separately have uh Honor Health land use attorney talking to you about the city's general plan and PCD and land use policies. Um, city staff, your city staff and this is their job has analyzed those thoroughly. They're recommending approval of both of these applications.

Um, you know, I have three boys. I don't tell personal stories hardly ever, but I have three boys. Um, my youngest was born at the Honor Health Sha campus 21 years ago. Um, and it was a great experience. I actually and I will tell you I'm come the second part of this is I come from rural Kansas. You know I was able to get a pedicure in my room after I had a C-section. It was a welcome experience. Um my first two boys were born in uh rural southwest Kansas and Dr.

Kudson who I loved had delivered pretty much all 28,000 babies that had been born in southwest Kansas for decades. healthcare choice just does not seem to be a bad thing. Um, and so with that, I think, you know, this conversation should refocus back on land use and the comments and questions that you as a commission members have for us uh and city staff. And so with that, I'm I'm gonna stop my remarks and we'll sit down and um hopefully let you start to deliberate.

We and one quick uh we do, as I mentioned in my initial presentation, have a couple of the staff stipulations that we've already um proposed some modifications to. I do have copies of that um that when we get to that point, I want to just make sure we don't forget to uh to discuss that. If you have copies, can you just send them up here so we can Sure. pass them around while people are asking questions. Uh with that, I'll go ahead and open up to the commissioners.

Um, I think probably try to be a little bit more systematic if we can. So, I'm looking at both ends on who kind of wants to go first and maybe go in a progressive order. So, Mr. Ertell, did you have a question? Well, I know, but there's we're all going to have lots of questions. So, I was trying I was trying to allow each person to sequentially uh go through there. Okay. Thank you. All right. Go ahead, Commissioner Reed.

I'd like to make a motion that the planned community district findings we're looking for for discussion and comments. Questions, we're not quite ready to entertain a motion. Okay. But thank you. Uh so circling back questions from the commission. Okay, I'll start while we're waiting for other commissioners to get their questions in order. U I'm going through the report a lot of it last minute.

Uh so I I was able to kind of get some information and a couple areas I wanted to dial into and make sure I understood. I know um as part of the the state land department sale, there was a requirement that any additional water needs for this project will be supplemented with water rights from the applicant. I didn't see that in in the staff report and I'm curious.

I'd like to hear from the water department if the basis of design contemplated a similar use so we could understand what the differential in water needs are for this project versus what's allowed in that zone so that we could have a clear understanding of what water rights if any would need to be part of this application. Yes, Mr. Chairman, we do have uh representatives from the water resources department on the way to the podium. Thank you. Commissioners, my name is Scott Mars.

I'm an engineer with the water department. With me is Resa Ramen, also an engineer. So, you please restate your question, Commissioner. Sure. Uh, as part of the Arizona State Land Department sale, this project, specifically Banner, is required to make all infrastructure improvements. uh for this project. Traffic for example to do street improvements, any off-site improvements, infrastructure buildouts, water mans, sewer mains, dry utility extensions, you get the drill.

But there's also an additional item in there that based on the water demand of this project versus something else in that. Let's see if it says Crosswords Roads East PCD.

uh that any differential in water demand that is in excess of that needs to be secured with water rights to the city and as I went through the basis of design I did not see any reference to that and I want to know if that was calculated and where we stand chairman yes uh when demands are over 100,000 gallons per day combining both indoor and outdoor use a water demand exhibit is required to be prepared and submitted to council uh that has been requested of them.

Their current demand in their BOD basis of design is 350,000 gallons per day average. Fantastic. Now, is there a comparative to what would otherwise be in the current zoning for that area and do we understand what the differential is so that we can understand what water rights if any are needed as part of this application? Certainly.

uh chairman, comparatively Optima and ASM are required to bring water to the table and there could be different forms of that water rights long-term storage credits. I can't remember which those two elements brought to the table, but that was negotiated with Brian Bemire, the previous executive director, uh and uh the mayor, excuse me, and the city manager. Understood. This is specific to this banner project. And so the banner project is required as well to do it.

And so I just asked the question again. I did not see it in the basis of design, but where was it determined what the level of water usage would be versus what is with Banner? And have we discussed water rights if they're needed? Chairman, the threshold is 100,000 gallons. We did require that that exhibit be prepared and given to city council for further decision. That's all the information. That's all the work that we've done in water resources engineering with respect to that demand exhibit.

Okay. So there was not a comparative analysis to comply with condition seven of the Arizona State Land Department letter. We chairman we followed the 100,000 uh gallons per day threshold and requested the demand exhibit. That that's all that we looked at with respect to the design standards and code in the city. Okay. I just want to make sure I'm understanding you so I don't belver the point. I don't mean has to get caught on this.

Are you saying that the use would be 100,000 gallons and they're producing or needing 300 plus thousand gallons and there's a 200 plus thousand differential. The 100 chairman 100,000 gallon threshold is what drives the demand exhibit requirement. The 350,000 gallons per day average demand that was stated in their base of design report, their engineering base of design report. That's the number that they calculated.

That's a number that we reviewed and had dialogue back and forth with the applicants consulted answer question. So I guess I I'm needing some clarity. Mr. Curtis, can you can you help me understand a little bit there? Is there a $150 to $200,000 delta and water requirements? And maybe I can have the applicant uh speak to it that that may be of benefit. I'm I'm hoping you all understand what I'm asking.

Uh chairman, are you referring to the sewer that we sewer uh demands that we have with respect to banner? The the delta being that we will get a certain amount of sewer resource back into the system compared to what the demand is. Is that the delta you're referring to? No, sir. This is actually for water usage, not not drainage or or disposal. This is this is securing water rights for the water that will be used by this specific project at this specific location.

that is a delta to what would otherwise be an allowed use on that site. At least that's how I interpret it. So chair, I I have no other further information to your question. Maybe. Thank you, sir. Mr. Would you happen to have an answer to that question? Yes, sir. Chairman Scarbor, um, yes, I can, I believe, answer your question. Uh, I think the there there are two different issues at play here.

The requirements that are outlined in the state land department authorization letter are specific to the Arizona State Land Department. You know, not they're not related to City of Scottsdale requirements. Prior to the Arizona State Land Department signing that letter, we actually went through an exercise where we provided our water expected water demands to the state land department so that they could evaluate those against um other uses that could occur on that site.

they were effectively wanting to ensure that with approval of this project, we would not be not very artfully stated, but eating into, you know, their water allocations for future projects going forward. Um, that was done outside of the city of Scottsdale and once we completed that analysis, it went through, you know, the review process at the state land department. they were satisfied um and they signed the letter that you have today.

Um, as a part of that, you know, and I think this doesn't speak specifically to the water rights, but we did uh participate with other developers in the area to uh in a development agreement that was approved last year with the city of Scottsdale to help fund the city's water uh infrastructure expansion project that's going to be moving forward in North Scottsdale to address water capacity uh for the region.

and um all of the development partners are paying their fair share and quite frankly paying the state land department's fair share as well because they're not uh ponying up. So that that's to the benefit of the rest of the state land that's up there.

Um the second piece of this that I think Scott was um talking about is our basis of design report as you noted uh provides that we have about 350,000 gallons per day which is over the threshold where the city does a separate independent analysis and it's an economic impact analysis.

uh they work through applied economics with Sarah Merley to do this to evaluate the uh water usage for the project compared against economic benefits and another a number of other factors and that's what I think he's referring that has been submitted to economic development to produce a finding or potential recommendation that would go before council. Um, so that process is is pending and we're pro participating with the city as they have requested that information from us. Thank you, Mr. M.

Dur. Uh, so for for me, this is uh banners to secure and provide to the city such additional water rights as necessary to satisfy the additional water demand of the banner property. Has the city received that? Because I did not read it in the report and I'm just trying to understand what that delta is clearly. Has the city received a an understanding of what the additional water rights may need to be. The state land department has not asked us to secure any additional water rights. Okay.

So, so this analysis has not been seen by this planning commission nor the city. It's underway right now. Uh the the city's economic development department is working through that and as as my conversation with um Josh Utterback last week in your economic development department, that's a recommendation they will pro provide for city council consideration. Okay. So, so we don't have line of sight or clarity on what that could look like. Is that correct? But that again is following city process.

Uh I think the report should have mentioned that that was an analysis that was taking place and that we should have some line of sight of what was going on especially with the letter saying that it needs to be provided to the city. Putting that aside, um thank you water department. Appreciate you very much. That was my only question for for the water department. Um, I got a question for the transportation department. Are they here? Yes. Perfect. Hi there. Hello.

Uh, so I'm I'm curious uh I I believe I heard perhaps it was Commissioner Joiner talk about the intersection uh at Hayden and Mayo. I believe the applicant said that it is currently being procured items for that intersection. It's underway. I did not see a stipulation though that ties it to the CFO which I think uh Commissioner Joiner has suggested we add and and that's great.

I guess my next questions are u are there any other stipulations for any other traffic improvements that this facility would affect in the near area? I'm thinking Mayo and 78th Street for one. I didn't I don't believe I saw any stipulations for participation on that. Based on this area with Banner, they play a role in needing that to be signalized by 2040.

So is there some stipulation or agreement or understanding of what participation this project will have with that future signal signalization of the intersection or roundabout? I think maybe that's the No, it's Miller. Sorry, that's Miller. Mr. Chair, members of the planning commission, my name is Hela Dominguez. I my title is senior traffic engineer.

Um as part of this development um they are stipulated to construct the signal at 78 street in Mayo as um the trips generated by the development um warrant the signal at this time. Okay. So I did I I don't know if I saw it in the stipulations. I don't think I saw that stipulation in in the report. I apologize if I missed that and please correct me if I'm wrong. Yeah, Mr. Bloomberg if we missed that. I do apologize but could you guide us? Also ask about the del Mr.

Chair, members of planning commission. So, I'm not um sure at this time if it was stipulated, but it was something that was recommended in the tea and something that we are looking for from the development. Perfect. My my question also then goes to Mayo and Miller. Same issue. Would you your recommendation was in the tea and then you're you're expecting a stipulation related to Mayo and Miller as well? That is correct. Yes. With further roundabout at that intersection. Perfect.

Um I I'd like to know what those look like. So I don't know if Mr. Bloomberg, you have those stipulations maybe in draft or do we need to just acknowledge that those are Sorry, Miss Miss Dermit. uh it the applicant would agree to those stipulations correct as part of the infrastructure buildout. Chairman Scarbor, yes, those are conditions u that are already included in the approved traffic traffic impact and mitigation analysis.

And so if you want to create separate stipulations, we're agreeable to that. I would I think it's important that we have those stipulations created in part of the uh the approval or recommendation uh right I because I think there are some timing considerations when signal warrants are met but I think we could certainly craft a stipulation that requires installation of those specific signals per the conditions outlined in the approved traffic impact and mitigation analysis or something like that.

Perfect. And then the the underpass of Miller Road. I I see that you all are going to improve Miller Road north of Mayo to a point relative to um maybe the northern property line of the development. I'm just curious uh from the transportation's perspective, is that sufficient in terms of of cost sharing uh as far as connecting that eventually to the north? Mr. Chair and members of the planning commission, yes, it is.

Um at this time it's not necessary to get connected it to go underneath the freeway as um ending the road just south of the um freeway underpass provides the connectivity that the development would need. Okay. And and I'm I'm really thinking more futuristic. I didn't see it in the tima but when that connection goes through banner and it's this facility would use that road as well.

So, I just want to make sure has has the transportation department fully looked at any kind of um participation from the applicant in terms of making sure that Miller Road connects in the future.

So, I'm assuming future developments north will participate coming south, but I want to make sure that we we actually bridge the gap in the middle and that the city's not stuck with it having to fund the difference between uh we ending the requirements of the northern property at the southern property line above the freeway and now we have this gap under the freeway that has to be resolved.

So, I want to make sure as a transportation looked at that and had any deliberations or discussions related to how to handle that portion in the future. Mr. Chair, members of the planning commission, that is not something that we have discussed, but I believe that the applicant is willing to provide inloo fees at this time um for the construction of the road underneath the freeway. Okay, perfect.

I I I was trying to warm up the other commissioners for questions, so I'm going to pause and let the other commissioners Okay. Well, then we'll go to Commissioner Joiner and then Commissioner or Vice Chair Young after that. Thank you. Um, in the uh transportation area, is there a D there? Okay. There's a street um north of Mayo that is ingress to both uh Honor Health Plus and the hospital. Is there a diesel lane that's being put in there?

because that's right after people come off the freeway and I did see the condition for a del lane uh turning on to Mayo. Is that correct, Mr. Chair? Commissioner Joiner, that is correct. Um, so there will be a right turn deceleration lane installed for that specific ingress only driveway. The queuing analysis provided by the consultant also showed that the queue will not extend past the limits of the turn lane and should not have negative effects on the traffic directly on Hayden. Okay.

So, there's not a diesel lane. Yes, there is. Okay. Okay. Sorry, it's getting late. I'm tired. [laughter] I'm sure we all are. Okay. Thank you. Sorry. Only question for now. Okay. Yeah. Vice Chair Young. Thank you, Chair Scarro. Um, this question is actually for uh Mr. Curtis. Um, so with the cup, as we saw in a case that came earlier with the um dispensary, uh, it had terms on it and they were asking to have those terms lifted.

I I'm assuming with this type of a project, the terms on this would be vested with the site and the project in generally in perpetuity uh unless there was any violations as I think Mr. Bloomberg had mentioned that uh would would trigger another look at it. So I I guess I I'm I'm assuming that's the case. I just wanted to ask the question. Yes, m Mr. Chairman and vice chairman. All conditional use permits um as Mr.

Kluff um provided earlier with that previous case um are subject to the potential of replication based off of um violation of the terms of the conditional use permit. Um so that's universal with all condition use permit if that answers your question. Well, some of these cases have had to come back for a reapplication for the condition conditional use permit. Correct. That we've been seeing. So I'm assuming that this one would be what determines the the terms of that conditional use permit?

So, Mr. Chairman and Vice Chairman, um most conditional use permits do not have a one-year timing stipulation or a fiveyear timing uh stipulation.

Um the ones that do um could be a temporary type of use where the expectation is they're only going to be there for a year and if and if you need more time then you can come back or um a brand new land use uh back in 2011 I think it was the marijuana became a land use that was permitted and um and because that was such a new land use um there were a lot of concerns about um how that would impact and use permits are based off, you know, how things are going to impact the surrounding community.

How would that impact? And so, we'll give you a five-year test run. Five years is a is enough uh to to establish the business and keep it running and see what the impacts are. Uh but after five years, if this turns out to be an incompatible land use, so new, um then it's something that they um that the community put a condition on, hey, five years, and come back and and renew it.

Um so those are the typical um cases that would have a five years when there's uh maybe temporary use or a suspect land use a new land use that uh probably needs to be re-evaluated. We have not done that for most condition use movements including hospitals. Okay. And I assume that I but I wanted to ask that question. Um so I I I I guess I also want to make a a comment. Um, I I I really appreciate both sides coming tonight to express their concerns, their opinions.

Um, everybody's very passionate about this project. Um, it's a little a little frustrating to me to hear these kind of arguments over healthcare. Um, I I heard one of the doctors got up and spoke earlier and said, "Don't think of them as competition. that's more collaborators. Soon as he sat down, then it went back to competition and we just see a lot of butdding heads here, which is unfortunate because this is healthcare.

Um, and and like I said in my opening remarks, this is frustrating after hearing this. And I've I've been living this case for a while now. And um I I think I may have even mentioned to Miss Demit I've I've learned more about healthc care than I ever wanted to know. Uh so which is good. I'm I'm glad I I got an education on it.

Um, one question that I've gotten, and I think this slide has actually been up, um, a couple of times tonight, uh, and it's on page 121 of the the the general plan, uh, HC 1.1. Support the development, preservation, enhancement of critical healthc care facilities, particularly in underserved areas. work with healthcare administrators to plan and develop facilities of the most suitable size, location, quality, and type. So, that's been beat to death tonight.

One side says there's a gap in service, the other says we've got plenty. So what and I've heard Banner MD Anderson's got oncology. They've got special um uh specialists that work in those those types of uh facilities. Honor Health has the same. So what is special that's going to be brought to this hospital in this area that is going to benefit the city? I'm not talking about just choice. What specifically? Because I'm looking to see where the gap is that makes this so necessary in this location.

You know, I hate to put it so simply, but you know, some people like Starbucks, some people like Dunkin Donuts, and should we make that choice for our community? you know, there is not a clear um message here other than in neuroscience, we currently have a stem cell um clinical trial to cure Parkinson's. We currently have clinical trials in Alzheimer's disease that have slowed the development of the disease. We have a lot of things that Honor Health does not offer.

That doesn't mean Honor Health has things we don't offer. The continuum of health is different depending on who your doctor is, who your health care provider is, what clinical trials are available. Banner is going to bring all the force of our academic relationships, our millions of dollars of clinical trials, our academic faculty to Scottsdale to serve the community, to give people true choice, to give people the option on a continuum of care in neuroscience, cardiovascular, um, oncology.

It's not to say Honor Health doesn't do great work in those areas. This is I'm with you. It's not about, you know, head-to-head. This is about we have different things in different areas of service. We have different talent, different different physicians, different faculty, different flavors. And we believe the community deserves to choose their own flavor and to get the health care that they want and they need on their own terms. And so I hope that you will all consider this.

And again, we are asking for a use that's less intense than the current zoning. So, you know, I I I listened to the conversation tonight and we're actually do, you know, I was just thinking to myself, we could without a zoning variance, we could have acres of marijuana fields in this spot. You know, it's like we are asking, I mean, truly, we're asking for a variance to do what we think is something really, really productive and really, really good for the citizens of Scottsdale. Okay.

So, I guess going back to my question, what is it special that's coming to this particular site? I'm talking land use. Yeah. What what is missing in in this hole of the donut? You got it. So, Banner Health, this is an important feature. Um, Banner Health also has an insurance company. Okay. And so, what does that mean? What that means is that most health care benefits from sick people. I mean, Honor Health, they get paid, we get paid.

When people get sick and we do something to them, we get paid because Banner Health is an insurance company. Because we benefit when people stay well, we have a different approach to revenue. So we can actually invest in wellness and still make a margin. This is a dramatically different business model than most hospitals and this is how we are going to change the cost curve in this country.

Banner Health is leading this nationally because we get premium dollars to keep people well and we have many members many of our members at least 50,000 of our members members who own Banner Insurance live in this community and what that different flavor is is that when we keep these people well we win. Everybody wins. the community wins. It becomes more affordable. The patient wins because they stay well. And Banner wins because we still make a margin. That's unheard of in health system world.

The only way most health systems make money is to find a sick person, do something to them, drop a bill, and find another sick person. We are trying to change that paradigm at Banner and it matters. So when we look at how we are changing the economics of health system delivery, care delivery through this conjun through this alignment of care and coverage. We want to bring that to Scottsdale. That matters.

That matters from an access perspective, an affordability perspective, and it gives us the investments that we can make in chronic disease management, clinical trial offerings, all the wonderful things that academics through the University of Arizona and we also have various relationships with ASU, we are going to bring to this community. Okay. Thank you. Thank you, Vice Chair. Any more questions from the commission? Commissioner Gonzalez. Thank you very much.

Um, one thing that I'm just making a comment and I'm going to ask a couple of questions, but one of the things that this commission does is zoning. Zoning is very important to us. That's what we do. We look at a zoning. We look at the use. Does this work? But also we have to look at the future. We're not here stationary. City government doesn't work that way. We have to keep evolving. We have to change. We're not the federal government. We don't have unlimited funds, unlimited time.

We have to make decisions based on the well-being of the city. Not just the zoning, but what will the future be in the zoning? What can planning do for the city? What the city needs? It's unfortunate that this became a competition. It shouldn't be a competition. I really appreciate the questions that my fellow commissioner asked. What's missing? What's not missing? What, you know, how can we fill this gap? How can we make this city better? What makes this city better?

Well, first of all, we have to make the city work. We have to make it fundable. We have to make We cannot live off of tourism for the rest of our lives. That's not practical. We have to be able to commit ourselves to being able to fund everything that we need here. And one of the ways we do it is because I'm basically a real estate person is we have to provide a service to people.

If we provide the service to the people, they will come here, they'll spend the money, they want to live here, they pay their taxes, we can make this city work. So the important part of it is well, what is people wanting? Health care is a very important feature. As I know now, as I get older, I'm I'm there all the time. I'm a I, you know, I live most of the time either through family or friends at Honor Health. I understand that's an important part, but they are not the complete donut.

Like we said, there are missing parts of everything. I've been at Banner and I've been at Honor Health. I'm I'm personally involved with Honor Health, but there are aspects of this that we have to to look at. And one of the things we have to do is serve the community. And the best way to serve the community would be to keep our health care system very strong, make it viable, make it profitable, make it worthwhile. It's a business. It has to thrive. If it doesn't thrive, doesn't work.

Doesn't work for any of us. So this is an important factor in planning our future. So the most important part of all this is to be able to make the people in Scottsdale and North Carefree, Cave Creek, everybody still work within the state. So we need these continuing moving forward. We have to keep moving forward. And you know, one of the things that was brought forward is Scottsdale. people, a lot of people say, you know, Wisconsino has so many people and everything.

Well, actually, we we lost um population about 5% over the last five years. And that's because not a lot of people moved out of here, but their families, the young families and everything, people have moved on. They've graduated. They found other other uh sources of income out of the areas. So we've lost a little population yet the aging population needs health care more than anybody and that's what we have.

So as a service to the community I feel that going forward with another health care facility would help promote a better business venue than anything else for that property. So that's basically my viewpoint and that's one of the questions I wanted I had was concerned about was the helellipad. How was that going to impact our neighbors and everything? Well, we just got the stipulations here and I'm satisfied because we have lots of helicopters in the Scots Air Park already.

All we had to do was get find a way of the FAA statement saying how we can make this work. How can we make the the air safer or at least maintain the level of security we have for the Scots Air Park area. So, I'm satisfied with that. I'm satisfied that we're going to need the facilities and I want to be able to go forward and maybe produce something that of good value to our citizens. Thank you. Thank you, Commissioner. Any other So, I do have a question for staff.

Uh, this is working in the hypothetical, but uh I'm not sure uh Mr. Bloomberg or Miss Mr. Curtis would answer this question. If Honor Health wanted to add on to their one of their facilities, one of their hospitals, could they by right do that? Could they put in more beds is my question. U Mr. Chairman and uh Commissioner Drake, I think the answer is yes. I mean, we have um um proposals all the time for a variety of businesses, including hospitals, to do additional things.

Um you could see at the Sha campus, they just um built the parking garage. Um so, I think the answer is yes. Obviously, they'd have to comply with the zoning um and uh and building codes and everything else, but I think the short answer is yes. I'm not sure if that's enough. I think that is. I just wanted to make sure like maybe the zoning was okay for a particular facility if they did want to expand.

So certainly and and as we would do the review, Commissioner Drake, the um we'd have to compare it with what the perhaps the original zoning stipulations were. if they limited to a site plan uh and only three buildings and they wanted to build a fourth one and we'd have to be talking about we potentially have to go back to zoning to amend that approve a site plan to get that fourth building to see how the impacts are addressed with regard to that. Okay.

I'm curious because I wanted to bring up the applicant again just either of you just I wanted to ask the question of the project timeline for building out and if let's say another hospital wanted to add more beds and I'm just curious if you would be finishing you know because it is a a determination of uh how many beds are needed in Scottsdale and our our area. So, I wanted to wanted to get that uh clarification. Sure. Let me let me try to address that.

Chair Scarboro and Commissioner Drake, thank you for the question. Uh, a couple of things I want to make uh in response to your question. First of all, it's I think it's important to note in the city of Scottsdale, there is no zoning that allows a hospital by right. So, in any event, you're looking at commercial office with a conditional use permit or you've got to build a special campus district for your zoning.

So there isn't anyone who could come before the city of Scottsdale and just decide to build a hospital on some parcel of land. In any event, those zoning cases are going to come through to this bo to this body and to the city council. So I think that's a very important clarification.

Second piece I'll mention is I would imagine that many many years ago when Honor Health Sha campus was built or Thompson Peak, they probably came forward with a similar plan that said this is our master development looking out 50 to 100 years. We think this will grow over time and and similar to the way we're approaching this project, I my understanding of history is just of that. So if memory serves, Thompson Peak started around 60 beds. It has grown over time.

Um to the comment of need, Honor Health also announced they're going to expand and add 56 beds there again. So I know it's kind of weird to talk about need again. Putting that back aside, last comment I'll make is we have been, I think, very forthright in suggesting that we are open to stipulations relative to the timing of this conditional use permit.

To Commissioner Young's u sorry, Chair Young's uh comment, uh if there were dialogue to be had around we'd like to see some timeline on the conditional use permit, we could certainly discuss what that would look like. uh from a banner perspective, we do have this uh in our near-term capital plan and I think as we've shared with this body, it is a three-year build, so it will take time to bring this facility forward. I hope that addresses your question. Yes. Thank you so much. Questions?

Point of clarification. Um, Chair Scarro, the the downtown medical subdist allow hospitals by right, but it is a medical subdist and that's why if that helps, but that's just downtown. Thank you. Does that help? Okay, question. Excuse me. I really haven't had questions because I I thought all of my questions had been answered earlier by um in meetings ahead of time. Uh but I do appreciate the questions that were asked tonight in diving deeper into uh the traffic signalization.

Um you know, I would be content to leave that as part of the a a feature of the traffic impact plan, but I think it does make sense to include that in what we're doing tonight. um some of the other things that have come up. Um but I end up looking at any proposal uh with three measures, amenities, aesthetics and economics. Um the amenity is we would be getting another 300 hospital beds and you is that a good thing? I believe it is a good thing.

Now, some people have suggested, "No, we have enough beds." Um, I received a um a schedule of um beds around the around the valley and Scottsdale in terms of beds per thousand. We came in third at 3.6, 3.5, 3.7, whatever. Um, and that's ahead of Glendale Mesa. Glendale has 3.2. Um but ahead of us, Sun City, Sun City West, 10.8, 14.5. Um, now this is just numbers on a page, of course, but um age has something to do with it. And I know you look at me and think, what do I know about age?

But uh you know, Scottdale is an aging community. Uh, so the fact that we're ahead of Glendale and Mesa and Goodyear, um, Queen Creek, um, that's nice, but at the same time, I don't think that there's really a cap on the number of beds. Besides, to be arrogant, this is Scottsdale. We shouldn't be saying, well, we can only put a hospital in where it's underserved. You know, what's that going to be? You know, South Phoenix. Um we're not concerned with for this purpose with South Phoenix.

We're concerned with Scottsdale. U it was mentioned that well the general plan says um approve you know health care in especially in uh particularly underserved areas. Well particularly doesn't mean exclusively. So there's nothing that says you can't have another hospital in North Scottsdale just because there's one there already or two. Um so anyway, but amenities, you know, 300 beds too much of a good thing? No, I don't think so. Um is it bad for residents to have more choice?

And I say it's a good thing. Um aesthetics. Um I looked at this earlier. The medical facility would fit into the general plan. um the greater air park character area plan and it substantially fits into the previously approved zoning. The change to zoning moves it from industrial park to commercial office. So later I'll you know I look at economics and I think well the city would get taxes off a off a distribution center. We if Amazon moved in there uh we'd get taxes off of that.

Is that really what we want? If we're looking at aesthetics, and I am in that section, um, it's better to have a hospital. The hospital would look good according to the artist rendition, even though they have the Arizona flag displayed incorrectly. That's okay. It's just a rendition. Um, it's a it's it's going to be an attractive building. Um, it'll be better than a distribution center. Economics brings in jobs.

I appreciate the clarification on uh bed employment as I'll put it versus um outpatient um employment. So it makes sense 2500 I think it was 200 additional jobs. That's not a bad thing. It's good for the economy. Now, this being a U nonprofit, the city doesn't make any money off the hospital, per se, but we're not in business just to make money off of, you know, facilities that go into Scottsdale. As uh Commissioner Gonzalez pointed out, I believe it was him, you know, we're here to serve.

This is we're here to provide services. Um, and we're not in the business of saying, "Well, there are enough hospital beds." That's what the market decides. Uh if it turns out that Banner is wrong and they can't fill the beds, that's on them, not on us. You know, we're not out because of that. Uh would it dilute the workforce? Um it could just as easily draw more people in, more employees in. So, you know, who knows what the answer is.

We'll see what the answer is, but it's not foregone that just because you have a static pool of employees today that that pool can't be expanded or that it can't be shifted. You know, Dr. Risk moved. I don't think that Honor Health says we're going to go out of business because Dr. Risk moved. No, they fill in. They fill in. They make it work. Um the big cost to Scottsdale, which I mentioned, is we're not going to have a for-profit distribution center.

So, we're not getting uh um you know tax revenues from that. There's also the cost of traffic, but and I appreciate the questions that were raised and the answers that were given. I had talked to an a traffic engineer before on this and we agreed there's not a huge burden that this hospital would put on the existing um uh streets. Um not everybody agrees with that. I see. But that's not what's causing the u service ratings of E and F at Mayo and and Miller and Hayden and 101.

That's that's there. You know, the commit would would be commitment would be uh to improve things with signalization. That's a good thing. Um traffic uh air traffic um I don't see that as an issue. Um, I understand that. Okay, we're mingling helicopters and and commercial aircraft. Uh, not very many helicopters. You say one flight per week, that's one outbound, but there's also the inbound, so it's two flights per week. But that's not a huge deal.

Um, in my formative years, I saw lots of helicopters flying and lots of aircraft flying, and that's not the issue. Um, they get along. They get along. you know, the FAA says they will. Uh, to sum it up, economically, proposal makes uh is a plus because it creates a net increase in Scottsdale employment. Aesthetically, the hospital would look better than a distribution center. And for amenities, choice and health care is a good thing. So, I'm recommending council approve this request.

Are there any more questions? Yes. Okay, questions. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Boy, everybody's still here. It's late and I feel like we're in such rarified air room with so many doctors in the room. So, I don't think I've ever been in with this many doctors. So, um and I want to commend the Banner team. Uh I enjoyed my visit with them. I think I learned a lot. They are extremely wellprepared and I feel honored that they took the time to talk with me.

That being said, have a couple comments. If I can get my laptop to stop up here. Um, we are an advisory commission. We don't make the decision. Our city council does. And I know just from my text that many of them are watching this proceeding. So, our job is to point out things that we're concerned as citizens about for them to think about to help them make their decision. Our job is not to make the decision.

Uh I'm told that hospitals are exempt from property tax and sales tax and this is an extremely pe valuable piece of land. So that does concern me because I don't want an Amazon thing there. But I do care that we're losing property tax and sales tax. Uh I'm also concerned about the height of the the kind of the discrepancy in the application. So hopefully when you get to city council you'll change that.

But um phase one shows a 74 foot building but yet I'm being told fa the phase three is really the 74 foot building. And um so I I I think that needs to be clarified before you go to city council. Uh the airport advisory commission recommended denial and I realize that was before the FAA report came out. However, the FAA report also states that their approval is subject to the city's governance. The Scottsdale airport is operated by a tower that operates from 6:00 to 900 p.m. 6:00 a.m.

to 900 p.m. And I'm told that the pilots communicate back and forth with each other during off hours. The applicant has removed the Southeast flight, and I think that's a good thing. And assuming all pilots that fly after 10 o'clock at night are talking to each other. Um that would be what we would hope.

The helicopter I think would create an unnecessary risk and the like I said the discrepancy of the four tower four foot tower and the five foot tower I think the helicopter is going on the five foot fivetory tower when it's ready to go. I that's how I read it. I hope that's right. Might want to clarify that. Um I am hos very concerned about the hospital's water use. I have all the confidence in the world that that's going to be fixed before you get to city council.

My biggest concern continues to be traffic. I disagree very much with my fellow commissioner about the traffic. I sat on the applicants on Mayo Boulevard in front of these this place for 25 minutes and talked to somebody while I was there. And what we're what we're forgetting is we've got four towers of Optima being built. We've got the the ship manufacturing. We've got maybe the hospital going here. We've got Honor Plus going. And everybody's forgetting Axon is going to go in.

So, we're going to have axon and apartments over there. So, the density and the traffic in that area is going to be unbelievable. So, I absolutely would insist that that light go in. And I still am not sure I understood from the traffic about the del lane in that street that turns right right after the freeway exit. So, just nod. You don't have to come up, but there is a del lane there because it wasn't showing on our application. So that might need to be made more clear.

Um, a comment was made about Scottdale still going to grow by 100,000 by 2030. That's four years from now. There's no way that's going to happen. I think that's probably a mistaken comment. I think it might maybe the northern area might go, but Scottdale I hope we're not going to grow by 100,000 in four years. Um that number will represent the northeast valley which includes Phoenix Carefree Cave Creek and all the surrounding areas. We currently are served by three hospitals.

One mile away is Mayo, one mile away um we have the uh Thompson Peak Parkway. I'm sorry I'm getting tired. Um so I I think we have adequate hospital in there. But um those are my comments. So, any questions buried in there? There's no questions. Okay. Okay. Any questions, though? I'd like to get through questions. I know we all want to uh state our our our comments. So, I'm going to throw a couple more questions out and then we'll we'll finish up with comments if that's okay.

Um, so I kind of want to go back again.

We have uh the vice chair's point belabored HC1.1 but within that uh as commissioner also says particularly in underserved areas not definitively or oh sorry I'm not talking into the mic I apologize uh it does say particularly underserved areas there's an emphasis on that doesn't mean it's definitive but there's an emphasis it's really the next sentence that I want to dive into and I want to ask staff it says work with healthcare administrators to plan and develop facilities of the most suitable size, location, quality, and type.

Now, this is the general plan talking to the city to work with healthcare administrators. Uh, Mr. Curtis, has there been any kind of health care services analysis, assessment, study done for what the health care needs are and where we're deficient, not deficient, sufficient? Is there anything that has been done in the recent past with the city? Uh, Mr. Mr.

Chairman, members of the commission, not that I know of um specifically to that, but I just do want to draw your attention that for decades this area has been um um in the general plan a regional use corridor. And I think when we look at this, we look at um the purpose and the aspiration of the regional use corridor.

And with this in terms of the location and banner um coming forth with this application um there was consistency with the general plan in that regard without necessarily having um additional studies uh being performed regarding uh land use planning and medical use planning for Scottsdale. Well, I appreciate the the take. I I think I look at it slightly differently. Uh but I do appreciate the take.

I I don't view hospitals as the three gas stations all in the same corner competing with each other. I think one of the speakers I think actually said it better than I could that healthc care is infrastructure. Now, I'm not saying that literally, but this is something that is different than three gas stations competing. This is different than two uh burger joints across the street competing. This is different. We don't have hospitals that come in here very often. In fact, ever, I think.

So, uh, I look at it a little bit differently. I look at, uh, the basis HC11, which the applicant used in their narrative to support this. I've I've understood it. I've read it. Um, and so, thank you for that clarification. Um, the other one is for maybe Mr. Bloomberg on u, the public safety side of it.

The fire department says there could potentially generate a higher frequency of fire alarm and system activation responses and require specialized fire suppression, hazardous materials response capabilities. It says could potentially. Do we have anything more definitive to understand from the fire department in terms of this project that is not three gas stations competing with each other so that we as an advisory board can make a very good decision and and give to council a good recommendation?

Chair Scarboro and commissioners. Um that statement was actually was actually formulated by the chief. Um we don't have anything in the case materials that backs that up. Okay. It was just basically a summary from the fire department. Okay. I mean this is again a very specific special use um in terms of it is not not common. And so I know that we have traffic studies that help us understand traffic. We have water studies a basis of analysis that help help us understand water usage.

But I really would like to better understand what impacts would be to the fire department and and specifically if there is some sort of additional uh capabilities that the fire department needs to support this project. I'd like to understand how this project would participate with the fire department and making sure that that the cost is bore by the project that needs these specialized response capabilities potentially. So I if there isn't more. [laughter] Chief, I I appreciate you.

I think I understand that. So th those are my questions to to kind of get to the to the root of it. So I guess we'll go around now and we'll uh Oh, okay. Vice chair question. Thank you. Um this this is for the applicant, Miss Stemit. Um so if this does move forward, hospital gets built. Is this uh and I think it was uh Mr. Jordan that had some exhibits that he showed some air traffic patterns around the airport.

Is is this would this building or having a helellipad on this property affect existing air traffic patterns or create restrictions over the hospital that would normally have been flown? I am going to ask Thank you for that question. I am going to ask Richard, is Richard still here? Richard Swedberg, who is the CEO, COO of Banner Air, um, to come talk to you about that more specifically. Thank you. Thank you, Commissioner Scarboro, and Vice Chair Young and Commissioners.

In response to your question, no. Uh, there would be no change to the airspace or how the airspace would be used by any of the other or the current air traffic. Uh most of your air traffic that flies in and around Scottsdale has certain pattern altitudes that the FAA requires them to fly. Those tend to be about a thousand feet above the ground. So they would be significantly higher than the helicopters.

The helicopters themselves actually operate at a much lower altitude uh specifically to maintain that separation. Okay. Um, and then, and I'm just curious, uh, I can't remember who brought it up about, um, you know, the air traffic tower ending operations at a certain time of the day and that after those hours, um, pilots are communicating with each other. Uh, I I did not know that. I thought there would be somebody on on the watch all the time, but I didn't realize that.

So, how does that work from a logistics standpoint? Is is there just an open channel? Everybody's talking kind of a thing. We got an emergency. We got to Aravac somebody off the the helipad at the hospital. You guys got to hold back on, you know, pulling away from the runway. Yeah, thanks for the question, Commissioner. So, the the uh airspace when Scottsdale Tower closes down, they turn over control of their airspace to Phoenix.

So, uh, whenever we transit through the Phoenix area, depending on on where we're sitting, how high in the air, or how low in the air we are, we're either talking to towers like Deer Valley or Scottsdale or dealing with uh Phoenix air traffic control. So, we would turn over control to them. That said, all the helicopters maintain what we call a common traffic frequency.

So, anytime we're in and around the Phoenix area, we're calling out, you know, this is Banner Air 5, here's our location, here's our altitude, here's where we're headed. And so, there's a lot of communication between the aircraft if anybody's in the similar area. Good example would be uh police and fire that use the helicopters. Okay. I'm glad you said that because that frightened me a little bit. [laughter] Okay. Thank you.

Yes, Chair Chair Scar Bro, could I take the liberty for just a minute to address one of the comments that you made previously about fire department coordination?

um because that has been a a discussion point that we've had and so we had um prepared uh and have shared with the city attorney's office some potential language to I I would hope addresses the comment that you just made um on the public safety front that Banner would uh shall would work with the Scottsdale Fire Department on communication and coordination for emergency services and responses and other needs prior to design review approval of this project to ensure that we do um go back to them and have that better understanding of their needs um if there are any um and that we would have that complete before we move forward on the design review front.

I appreciate that. Actually, the the comment was more focused in on uh participation in any kind of infrastructure buildout. I'll give an example. I I uh I did a project where we we built a 10-story hotel and that community didn't have a ladder truck. And so to make the development work, they had the community had to purchase a fire truck. Well, the community didn't, the project did.

And so what I'm asking is I I really would like to understand from the fire department, not I understand the communication. Uh we've had many conversations I've enjoyed with you and Mr. Freeman. Um, but this this comment in question is more specific to um, we don't quite understand what the impacts to the fire department and Scottdale's new ambulance service are.

And I'm just curious, has there been a review and understanding and analysis by the fire department, the ambulance service to understand if any impact exists and is is banner participating based on that impact? Understood. financially participating and the you know the way that typically works for us is that the Scottsdale Fire Department would come to us and say this is what we need from you um and that is what we negotiate through the zoning process.

We have not been asked to do anything by the Scottsdale Fire Department or provide any um enhanced infrastructure capital improvements or anything of that sort. And I appreciate that. Again, I I reference back to this is a unique individual project. This is not the uh quote unquote three gas stations competing on the same corner. Uh it is vastly different potentially in needs from the fire department and it's very unique. So, thank you for that response. Okay.

Please comments, not not motions yet. No comments. Okay. [clears throat] I tried to look at the and get guidance from the general plan to help understand what we're going to recommend to the city council and at least draw back to that general plan kind of a a framework so I could stay out of the emotional discussion because there's a lot of emotion around this issue. And I referred to a couple of goals and I have two kind of two points.

one, there's a goal LU7 to protect the viability of the Scottsdale airport. Goal S5 is to maintain self uh safe airspace. And goal S5.1 is to manage the Scottsdale airport safety and security programs to protect the users, the neighbors, and nearby properties. Now, I understand that the um airport commission recommended denial by a 5 to1 vote.

I was on the Scottsdale um not when they made this vote, but I was on the airport commission and I'm a pilot and I know the commitment that the airport commission has to the airport and to to safety. And the members of this commission have thousands of hours flying jets as well as small single engine aircraft and one is a flight instructor that has experience in both fixedwing and helicopter aircraft. Why are they opposed to this request?

Scottsdale is the 10th busiest non-commercial airport in the United States. 10th busiest. Scottsdale airport has very crowded airspace with larger and faster jet traffic coming in as well as more slower piston aircraft and training flights every year. That makes for a busy busy airport. The airport, the banner site is located right under the aircraft takeoff and landing patterns right under it. They they didn't have to locate it there, but they chose to.

And that's right under the the landing pattern. And I will say that most aircraft coming into the pattern are 800 feet above the ground. 800 feet above the ground. When you have jets that are typically flying 120 to 150 miles an hour compared with the space with the airplanes piston airplanes flying at 75 and 85 miles an hour from the ground to up to the your 800 or a,000 feet is not a lot of room when you're flying that fast and it's that busy.

Pilots are really busy during takeoffs and landing and additional hair air helicopter traffic at low altitudes compounds that safety. And just because the airport or the FAA approves a hos helicopter pad does not make it a safe operation. And I think we saw reference to what happened in Washington DC. This was a commercial jet that collided with a helicopter even after and even when it was under the jurisdiction of a control tower.

The airport commission um vote prioritized public safety and protecting the community as outlined by the goals stated in the general plan and they're supported by Scottsdale firefighters. Lastly, I'd like to reference the plan goal HC1 that says promote access to health care human services for the citizens and policy HC 1.1 to support the development and preservation um and enhancement of health care.

Scottsdale currently has more than a thousand a thousand bed or has more beds per thousand residents than all but two other cities in Maricopa County. This is not an underserved area in need of additional hospital beds. The current and future health care needs of the community are currently met being met by existing providers.

Honors Health's Thompson Peak Medical Campus is expanding its capabilities in coordination with the general plan and have already received unanimous approval by the city council. Construction of additional hospitals does not equate to an increase in medical personnel.

Rather, it risks deepening the shortage of health care professionals and contributing to an overupp of hospital beds in Scottsdale and an imbalance that is shown to drive up costs for uh for patients when without improving services. This is like building a factory with more space in it than what is needed. You have to allocate that fixed overhead against the people that are in the hospital and that is an economically un unviable and it creates increased cost.

A demonstrated community need has not been substantiated and Scottsdale is not an underserved population. I think that this initiative may be driven primarily by insurance interests and not in the needs of the community. The intended con the unintended consequences if approved will be over capacity, higher cost, further continuing shortage of health care professionals and an imbalance that is shown to drive up costs without improving outcomes. Thank you. Thank you.

Any other commissioners have comments to make? Well, I'm going to be making a comment. Um, yeah, it's been a really a lot of back and forth, a lot of thinking, a lot of taking in all the information. We've really received an amazing amount of uh input and uh uh it, you know, it's it's it's been challenging for me to think about these things.

So, you know, when you I guess what I'm saying is when you hear that uh another hospital is coming to the area, you you might think that it's it's a great thing. I mean, you're you're feeling uh that well, I I'm sorry. Uh the the hospital coming into our area is a is you would think it's I'm really sorry. I apologize. I'm just a little tired out, guys.

But, uh, looking at C1-1, uh, I really feel that, uh, this, and I apologize again, uh, I feel that it's the need is for the entire area of, of, uh, Phoenix, but maybe not at Scottsdale. So when I'm looking at this, I'm considering the general plan and how that works for the SC residents of Scottsdale. So I have been uh leaning more towards that decision and uh it it's uh one that I wish I could I mean I'm feeling more strongly into that one. So thank you so much. Thank you, Commissioner.

Okay, I believe we have one last question from Commissioner Re. Not a question. Okay, doc. We're still want to make sure we're getting comments out. If you want another question, if you want another question, I can handle that. Um the U staffing levels, you know, we've heard that it's, you know, another hospital would dilute staffing. Does, you know, this I guess a question for the CEO of of Banner.

Um, I don't know if you get into the weeds on staffing, but do you typically um overstaff, you know, at your other hospitals? Um, and then I guess that question would go to uh honor health experts as well. Do you typically overstaff or do you staff according to what the need is? Yes, thank you, Commissioner.

Um, I wouldn't I hope we don't overstaff, but we tend to have very robust staffing because we want to make patients, you know, are served in an appropriate manner and get the service that they want. But no, the the service uh the the the labor productivity is similar to other other industries where we staff to the need. And uh we believe there's going to be, you know, a lot of activity on this campus in terms of both outpatient and impatient services.

and and it takes a lot of team talent to provide the kind of care that we like to which is you know really wrapping services around the patients. You're not an expert on honor health, but I perhaps you know from your contacts you would know. Do they overstaff? I mean I I just feel that there's a need and you in the community and you staff what regardless of the hospital you staff according to the need.

You don't we staff according to the need and I'm sure I'm sure honor health does the same thing. You know you we we we have an obligation to care for our patients in a very safe way. So we call it safe staffing and we make sure that we have enough um team members to care appropriately for our patients whatever their degrees whether it's physicians or advanced registered nurses or you know whatever specialty is needed. Thank you. Okay. Any other comments? Okay.

So I guess I'll go ahead and make some comments before we uh seek a motion here. Uh, Chair Scarough, may I um make a comment if you indulge me. I So, based on the the conversation and the discussion that we've heard from each of the planning commissioners, um, I do understand there are I think we've talked about a number of stipulations.

We've talked about some unanswered questions, whether that's related to the airport advisory commission, whether that's related to the fire department's needs, water resources, and I would uh respectfully ask at this point that the commission would entertain a request for a continuence of this item to allow us to have [clears throat] more time to work through these issues and find these answers um and come back to you with, I think, what you would consider a more complete um package of information.

Uh it is it is absolutely uh appropriate for for the applicant to make that request. Uh and so thank you. Uh since you have made the request, um I believe that's all we need Mr. Curtis to take a vote. Correct. It is not a motion that we have to initiate because it's an applicant directive or or I'm sorry, maybe miss maybe Mr. Via can. Yeah, for the record. Uh Mr. Chairman, I think um it would be appropriate to have a motion and a second and get a vote on a continuence. Okay.

Uh so we have um a request by the applicant for a continuence. Do you have a time to do you have a time frame? Do you have a to be determined a date certain? I think it would be appropriate to not not make that to a to a date certain to allow us sufficient time to work through the open questions. Okay. Uh so we have a request for a continuence uh with a date to be determined. Is there someone who supports that motion? I second that. Hasn't been made yet. Oh, I'm sorry.

So you're make are you making the motion then? No, not yet. I'll make the motion. Okay. I move we continue this to a date certain uncertain uncertain. Okay. And and do we have a second to that? Seconded. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And just for clarification, that's for both items five and six on the agenda. Yes. Date to be determined. Yes. Okay. So, are we are we covered procedurally there, Mr. Curtis, that we're we're considering both cases? Okay. Yes. To a date to be determined. Thank you. Okay.

Uh, perfect. So, with that said, uh, go ahead and have a roll call vote, please. Chair Scarro, yes. Vice Chair Young, yes. Commissioner Gonzalez, yes. Commissioner, yes. Commissioner Joiner, yes. Commissioner Drake, yes. Commissioner Reid, yes. Motion passes. Thank you. Well, I apologize everybody that this five hours, right? If we do this again, we'll try to do less than five hours. Uh, thank you so much for your time. appreciate it very much. Uh and we'll see you soon regarding this matter.

I know. I even I feel like I'm close to the mic when I speak, so I apologize everybody. All right, so we have one last item on the regular agenda. Number seven, planning commission, election of officers. So we're going to start off with nominations of the officers. And I'll go ahead and and throw out for the we're going to start with the chair and I'm going to go ahead and nominate Vice Chair Young for the chair position. Second. We're just nominations right now.

Are there any other alternative nominations? Almost. Okay. So, uh only person up for consideration. Uh so, do I have a motion for u vice chair for the chair? So moved. Okay. Do I have a second? Second. Perfect. All right. Uh, roll call vote, please. Chair Scar Bro, yes. Vice Chair Young, that's a dirty way of getting out of the next banner meeting, but but yes, [laughter] Commissioner Gonzalez, yes. Commissioner, yes. Commissioner Joiner, yes. Commissioner Drake, yes. Commissioner Reid, yes.

Motion passes. Thank you. Perfect. Next up on the uh slate is vice chair. Do I have any nominations for vice chair? I will nominate uh Mr. Young, Commissioner Young or Vice Chair Young. He's already the chair. You two look so much alike I can't tell. Bill, [laughter] the guy in the middle. The guy in the middle. Okay. Uh let the record show that Commissioner is pointing to me. Yes, I'll second that. Any other nominations for vice chair? Okay.

So, let's have a a motion for uh William Scarro for vice chair. Is there do we have a motion? So, moved. Okay. Second. Second. Okay. Uh roll call vote, please. Chair Scar Bro, yes. Vice Chair Young, yes. Commissioner Gonzalez, yes. Commissioner Hill, yes. Commissioner Joiner, yes. Commissioner Drake, yes. Commissioner Reid, yes. Motion passes. Thank you. All right. I think that wraps up our agenda. Thank you everybody. Really appreciate everybody's participation tonight. Have a great evening.

Is this a record? It's close.